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View Full Version : GLBT people, Satanists, and Nazis


Diane Vera
04-08-2007, 11:31 AM
On page 2 (http://www.soulforce.org/forums/showthread.php?t=2594&page=2) of the thread Another article (http://www.soulforce.org/forums/showthread.php?t=2594), ladyinred wrote:

Another one of his outrageous quotes:
"When lawlessness is abroad in the land, the same thing will happen here that happened in Nazi Germany. Many of those people involved in Adolph Hitler were Satanists, many were homosexuals -- the two things seem to go together."

-- Pat Robertson, March 7, 1990, on the "700 Club" (Overlooking that Hitler persecuted homosexuals much in the same way as the jewish people.)

It is true that there were quite a few occultists (not Satanists in particular, as far as I am aware) who supported Hitler. However, if what I've read on this is correct, Hitler then turned around and outlawed most of the occult organizations that had supported him, once he came to power. (These days there are some Satanists who support neo-Nazism, which I think is really idiotic. See my collection of articles Against neo-Nazism among Satanists (http://www.theisticsatanism.com/politics/Nazi/index.html).)

Likewise, there were at least some gay men in the SA ("brown shirts"), a paramilitary group which helped the Nazis attain power. But they were then purged, in the "night of the long knives," after the Nazis came to power.

As for the claim that Satanism and homosexuality supposedly go together, well, obviously, only a tiny minority of GLBT people are Satanists; and, as far as I can tell, the majority of Satanists are heterosexual.

However, a grain of truth in Robertson's claim is that controversial minorities of various kinds, including GLBT people, are to some degree overrepresented among Satanists.

Furthermore, historically, what is probably the modern Western world's oldest gay-friendly organized religion, Thelema, was founded by Aleister Crowley, who either was or was not a Satanist depending on how you define the word "Satanist." Later, Anton LaVey urged acceptance of gays in his Satanic Bible, written in 1969, back when even the more liberal Christians and even Wiccans were still pretty anti-gay for the most part, and back when gay bars were subject to frequent police raids even in San Francisco.

But I certainly wouldn't claim that the Satanist scene is consistently pro-gay. There are some pretty darned crude anti-gay bigots in the Satanist scene too, even in LaVey's Church of Satan.

Diane Vera
04-08-2007, 12:26 PM
In the above-mentioned quote, Robertson seems to be insinuating that acceptance of gays is a form of "lawlessness" which will lead inevitably to another Nazi-like regime. That is, of course, nonsense. As far as I am aware, the main factors that enabled the Nazis to take power in Germany were:

Germany's horrendous economic problems after World War I.
The common human tendency to seek scapegoats.
The fragility of Germany's democratic institutions, which at that time were not very old and had been imposed by foreign powers.

Alecto
04-08-2007, 11:01 PM
I'm always utterly confounded by the people who want to say that the whole Nazi thing was "the gays' fault". Just...wow.

That having been said, I found on wikipedia one night through an odd series of links that there's actually occult beliefs based around prominent Nazi figures. People, I concluded, are frickin' weird.

ladyinred
04-09-2007, 04:06 AM
If anything the religious right would like to usher in a era similar to Nazism. Since they disregard the constitution and conclude that this is strictly a Christian nation and only those strict adherents to the bible should govern.. Plus the fact that they want a theocracy and will not tolerate any version of Christianity other than their own. As far as other denominations within the Christian faith, they are going to hell.. along with the "evil " adherents of another faith.


The common human tendency to seek scapegoats. Sounds familiar,
it's the same ol' song and dance with the religious right. Thanks for the history lesson Diane.