I may be in the wrong place

[sailaway58]

I may be in the wrong place, but I hope not.
I am a straight male with a desire to understand some of my friends and their spiritual walk as they begin to deal with their sexual orientation. I am pushing 50 and from my days in High school I have struggled to understand for me what seems un-understandable. I don't have an agenda to change anyone or to talk anyone out of being gay, so relax:)
To say I am comfortable in this forum would be inaccurate, but I want to read and learn and grow in Christ as we learn to love and accept each other.
Tim

[u-dog]

I may be in the wrong place, but I hope not.
I am a strait male with a desire to understand some of my friends and their spiritual walk as they begin to deal with their sexual orientation. I am pushing 50 and from my days in High school I have struggled to understand for me what seems un-understandable. I don't have an agenda to change anyone or to talk anyone out of being gay, so relax:)
To say I am comfortable in this forum would be inaccurate, but I want to read and learn and grow in Christ as we learn to love and accept each other.
Tim

Sailaway!

If you are as you describe yourself, then you are NOT in the wrong place. We are a community of people who are mostly but not exclusively GLBT. We are eager to deal with people's questions when they are not being used to disguise an underlying sermon. Many of us are Christians (of every denominational stripe) but some of us are buddhist, pagan, Jewish, the occasional Muslim, and even some atheists.

Your self-description reminds me of my brother-in-law who was (he's gone now) a loving Christian Soul with not a molecule of hate within him who nevertheless just shook his head and said he "didn't understand" homossexuality. I, unfortunately, wasn't out to him before his death and couldn't really help him to understand. He has a grandson who has always set off my "Gaydar" but who is (if he is in fact gay) not out yet either.

[BenL]

Sounds like you've got a good attitude, even about what you consider a struggle. I sense you're a bit nervous being here. Relax. We don't bite. We don't even recruit ... despite what you hear from some of the people who don't accept us. Nor are you the only straight ally on these forums. There are plenty of them, thank God!

I suggest you read some of the threads. You'll notice that there is a preoccupation among some of our members with the so-called religious right. That's understandable, since most of the vocal opposition to lesbian, gay, bisexual and transgender people (LGBT) comes from that direction.

I'm glad you ended up here at Soulfoce. You might have stumbled on some nasty sites anywhere on the spectrum. I think you'll find most of the people here quite reasonable. We mostly want what you do: a chance at a decent life with the person we love.

Before you start, read the guidelines for the forums. That way you won't upset anyone. The main thing we ask is that everyone respect each other. When you feel comfortable, jump into the conversation. Respond to someone else or start a new thread (discussion topic). Ask questions. We've heard most of them before, but we're happy to answer them again or refer you to archival threads.

I see from your profile that you're a carpenter. Good profession. Jesus and Joseph were carpenters. Not a bad place from which to start your quest.

[keltic63]

sounds like you're in the right place, especially if you're here for dialogue and learning more about us. If, like u-dog said, you have a hidden agenda, trying to convert or condemn, well, it won't go very well.

a heads up: sometimes just the words a person uses can cause some offense. for instance, "lifestyle" is a poor choice; it's been used by many to suggest that there is not only a monolithic gay standard, but that it is a choice. I'm sure that someone would call you to task for using that word.

there are plenty of threads that you can read to help you understand us, take a look through the forums and read the threads. You will find some great information.

Ask questions, listen to the responses, and from your introduction, I think you'll do very well here. (if not, well, hey, I'm the moderator; I'll let you know how you're doing ;) )

Welcome to the forums

[Daniel]

Well.....I'm right up there with you- closing in on the magic half-century number myself.

You mentioned friends who are 'beginning to deal' with their sexual orientation at it relates to their faith. Sounds like someone who you've known for a long while came out to you- and it was a real head turner. I think that would get my attention!

Glad you found your way here. As mentioned by others, there are lots of threads here that are worth investigating. And you are welcome to start to your own.

Confronting new situations can be discomforting, but I think you will find that the majority of the members of this forum are very accomodating and helpful poeple. If you want to know about something or have a question- all you have to do is ask.

So fire away.

[SEGrether]

We need more people like you around! Welcome!

[andrewlittle]

I am one of the str8 allies that has been mentioned - although some believe I am quite bent in many ways. This is a community that loves to dialogue, and does it very well when the discussion is respectful.

We have had several visitors who have come and initially raised some hackles with the wording of their posts. In some cases, the wording was simply the result of a lack of familiarity with GLBT folks generally, and some touchy issues particularly. If that happens, don't be affronted - okay? It won't be personal, and there will be the opportunity to learn how to converse positively and constructively with people who are different than you are in some ways, and very, very similar in others.

Ultimately, the majority of folk here are very loving - nad they love to make new friends in particular. So, hopefully, welcome new friend.

Andy

[Zerbie]

Welcome Sailaway! As you describe yourself and your attitude, it sounds like this is the PERFECT place for you!

You've found a group of very friendly, caring, patient people. As a group, we get impatient if we feel we're being ignored, or our very existence is looked upon as "wrong." I doubt you will trigger any of these responses, based upon what you've written so far.

So you're not even 50 and you already have grandchildren? Wow! Congratulations!!

I understand you being uncomfortable visiting here at first. The first time I went into a "gay place" (it was a gay community center, 12 years ago), I was beyond nervous. I wasn't sure if I belonged there, what the people were going to be like. . . were they all going to be really weird?? Eventually, that wears off and you get used to the environment; people are just people,and you discover their traits as individuals, instead of worrying about whether gay people are all scary and weird.

This is a safe place for almost any question or discussion. If you maintain respect for the dignity of the other forum members, you can ask anything. You'll probably get a lot of open, honest, thoughtful answers, too.

[BruceChris]

Join our forums, read our threads and learn about us, and post your own opinions or experiencies. We are all children of God, and we are all people, not very different from the ones you meet every day. Please take a quick look at my church, I love It.

http://www.soulforce.org/forums/showthread.php?t=1093

Peace and Love, Bruce Chris

[tdogg]

Hi Tim, and welcome to the Soulforce forums!!! Glad you found your way here. I think you'll learn a lot and have an opportunity to share with us as well.

We are kind, compassionate and open-minded, but like others said, we do have a thing for respect. It's mutual too, you should expect us to respect you.

You should find answers to many of your questions, and probably raise more questions along the way. A good place to start is reading through all the threads/posts, you'll get a head start on getting to know us. Now, I hope you share more so we can get to know you better too. I hope you pick up some tips on how to support and encourage your friends in a way so they will feel loved and safe. That's so important, especially with those coming out for the first time. Many of us here have family and/or friends who have not been supportive. It's very difficult and hurtful.

This is a great place, fun, safe and lots of dialogue. Not all of it is profound, but much of it is. Not everyone are Christians, but that's another reason why it's so interesting. We get all sorts of views into issues, it's helps to expand our minds, hearts and knowledge!

Welcome Tim!!

Tdogg

[Jennifer5]

Welcome Tim, glad to have you here. You've come to the right place. :)

[sailaway58]

Wow,
Thanks everyone for the nice welcome. I am looking forward to the forums and plan to take advantage of this venue.
My journey to this site has been prompted, as someone mentioned, by a friend of 30+ years that recently came out. I have known and loved him since we were teens and I have known how much he has loved and still loves the Lord. He believes the church, I think out of ignorance, has lied to him about sexual orientation. Although I haven't agreed with most of my fellow Christians it didn't bother me enough to say much and I don't want my silence to keep someone from Gods love.
I really only wish my friend would have known I would not have forsaken him per his coming out.
If Christ’s love is for everyone, and I believe it is, then my silence in the church will only hurt those who are probably already facing a struggle alone that I admit I don't come close to understanding.
See you in the forums!
Tim

[Jennifer5]

Wow,
Thanks everyone for the nice welcome. I am looking forward to the forums and plan to take advantage of this venue.
My journey to this site has been prompted, as someone mentioned, by a friend of 30+ years that recently came out. I have known and loved him since we were teens and I have known how much he has loved and still loves the Lord. He believes the church, I think out of ignorance, has lied to him about sexual orientation. Although I haven't agreed with most of my fellow Christians it didn't bother me enough to say much and I don't want my silence to keep someone from Gods love.
I really only wish my friend would have known I would not have forsaken him per his coming out.
If Christ’s love is for everyone, and I believe it is, then my silence in the church will only hurt those who are probably already facing a struggle alone that I admit I don't come close to understanding.
See you in the forums!
Tim

We really do need more people like you in the world. You're friend is incredibly lucky to have someone like you in his life. :love:

[u-dog]

Wow,
Thanks everyone for the nice welcome. I am looking forward to the forums and plan to take advantage of this venue.
My journey to this site has been prompted, as someone mentioned, by a friend of 30+ years that recently came out. I have known and loved him since we were teens and I have known how much he has loved and still loves the Lord. He believes the church, I think out of ignorance, has lied to him about sexual orientation. Although I haven't agreed with most of my fellow Christians it didn't bother me enough to say much and I don't want my silence to keep someone from Gods love.
I really only wish my friend would have known I would not have forsaken him per his coming out.
If Christ’s love is for everyone, and I believe it is, then my silence in the church will only hurt those who are probably already facing a struggle alone that I admit I don't come close to understanding.
See you in the forums!
Tim


Tim,

You and I are the same age. I turned 50 in February. I have a friend of almost 40 years too. After coming out to my wife two years ago I have come out to my siblings, a few close friends, and a couple weeks ago to my three sons. The only person of importance to whom I still need to come out in order to live authentically (at least for a while) is my childhood friend. I have two (diametrically opposed) fears. One fear is that he will reject me. the other fear is that he will be hurt and offended that I did not confide in him years ago. We were and continue to be close friends (though time and distance have changed the relationship). what I want to say to him and to you is this:

I didn't withhold the information because I didn't trust him with it. I withheld it because his friendship, respect, and love were SO IMPORTANT to me. In my case, I was desperately in love with him for years (we became friends in 6th grade) and knowing that he was straight I worked VERY hard to make our relationship something that he and I could AUTHENTICALLY both claim. I was always careful about excluding this friend from my sexual fantasies. I was always careful to be sure that I didn't touch him in a way that would compromise him if he knew the truth. I was always careful to avoid behaving jealously about his girlfriends and made a special effort to befriend them. None of this was easy. All of it was done because I loved him and valued his love for me.

My point is... don't assume that your friend kept you in the dark because he didn't trust you. It may have been because you are such an IMPORTANT person to him and he was unwilling to risk even the possibility of losing it.

[sailaway58]

Tim,

You and I are the same age. I turned 50 in February. I have a friend of almost 40 years too. After coming out to my wife two years ago I have come out to my siblings, a few close friends, and a couple weeks ago to my three sons. The only person of importance to whom I still need to come out in order to live authentically (at least for a while) is my childhood friend. I have two (diametrically opposed) fears. One fear is that he will reject me. the other fear is that he will be hurt and offended that I did not confide in him years ago. We were and continue to be close friends (though time and distance have changed the relationship). what I want to say to him and to you is this:

I didn't withhold the information because I didn't trust him with it. I withheld it because his friendship, respect, and love were SO IMPORTANT to me. In my case, I was desperately in love with him for years (we became friends in 6th grade) and knowing that he was straight I worked VERY hard to make our relationship something that he and I could AUTHENTICALLY both claim. I was always careful about excluding this friend from my sexual fantasies. I was always careful to be sure that I didn't touch him in a way that would compromise him if he knew the truth. I was always careful to avoid behaving jealously about his girlfriends and made a special effort to befriend them. None of this was easy. All of it was done because I loved him and valued his love for me.

My point is... don't assume that your friend kept you in the dark because he didn't trust you. It may have been because you are such an IMPORTANT person to him and he was unwilling to risk even the possibility of losing it.
Thanks U-Dog,
I think you are right and on the scale of what he needed to do, who he needed to be honest with, talking to me about was the least of his worries.
Because of his position in the church as others find out more he will be rejected harshly by many I am sure.
Over the years he became extremely introverted and guarded, now I understand but I didn't really think about it much because were all busy living.
His family has embraced him and he is doing really well but it is still unknown to most.
One thing I see already is many here have similar stories.
I think living with this in secrete and adding to it you have been taught your life if you are gay you will burn in hell would make anyone introverted and or suicidal.
Another friend of mine about 5 years ago found out two out of his three sons are gay. They are a wonderful loving family but this really tested them. After he decided he could not talk them out of it things calmed down a bit. The younger son turned so angry it has been tough. I think it is better now but I really want to reach out to my friend and let help him understand his children better. To his credit he has kept the doors of communication open and they are doing pretty well.

[Zerbie]

Wow,
Thanks everyone for the nice welcome. I am looking forward to the forums and plan to take advantage of this venue.
My journey to this site has been prompted, as someone mentioned, by a friend of 30+ years that recently came out. I have known and loved him since we were teens and I have known how much he has loved and still loves the Lord. He believes the church, I think out of ignorance, has lied to him about sexual orientation. Although I haven't agreed with most of my fellow Christians it didn't bother me enough to say much and I don't want my silence to keep someone from Gods love.
I really only wish my friend would have known I would not have forsaken him per his coming out.
If Christ’s love is for everyone, and I believe it is, then my silence in the church will only hurt those who are probably already facing a struggle alone that I admit I don't come close to understanding.
See you in the forums!
Tim


:earth::dove: You are precisely the kind of friend the world needs more of!

Your friend is so lucky to have you!

:love::love::love:

[BrentRichards]

:earth::dove: You are precisely the kind of friend the world needs more of!

Your friend is so lucky to have you!

:love::love::love:

I was thinking exactly the same thing ... you're okay with me! (understatement!)

[tdogg]

Tim,

One thing that might help, there is a great book out there called Straight Parents, Gay Children. Don't have the author off-hand, but it's an excellent book with real-life stories of parents whose children have come out to them. Many of those children were brought up in conservative religious households, and the parents often have a very hard time dealing with a gay child. It's a great book, easy to read and I think would be very helpful to you. I got my copy at Barnes & Noble (the local one here has a healthy selection of queer reading material), you can probably order it from Amazon.com as well.

You seem like a compassionate and caring friend. They are lucky to have you. Your friends will need a lot of support as they continue their coming out process. :love: