status521

[status521]

wow. can't believe i'm here. can't believe i'm doing this. can't believe i have found something in the search for greater meaning.

now that was one heck of a set up, wasn't it?

reader's digest version: raised in conservative christian home. good family. good life. went to college and trained in education. ended up living overseas many years as a schoolteacher. returned and took a job as an associate pastor of a congregation in indiana. i am still there.

reality is i've been gay all my life... still not out of the closet... but have been on a search to figure out who i am and how God relates to all that. sounds stupid as a man of the cloth, but this is a somewhat new frontier on many fronts. this has been one heck of a tumultous ride. through a course of events 4 years ago decided to explore and discover what i felt i had been missing. i took 'pandora's box' and threw the lid back to see what was there. i would like to say i went the healthy route in this discovery, but that would be a lie. i've crawled in more beds than my mind would like to remember. that in itself is very humbling to write.

it was here of late i was told of 'stranger at the gate' and began reading it this past week. this is what led me here... initially attempting to contact mel white, i found this forum.

as you can read, my situation is sticky... and well... not very rewarding at the moment. all my friends are straight as this side of my life is buried deep. and so i am looking towards this place to be a safe environment to talk, discuss, hopefully gain some people who can bounce things back and forth w/out any judgment or condemnation.

is this the place for me?

[Zerbie]

Yes, this is the place for you, you are very welcome here. :love::love:

You will find friends here, I believe, with whom you can share those neglected parts of you, and bounce ideas back and forth with them.

Wonderful and brave of you to throw the lid off pandora's box and start viewing what's in there. Times like these are when we really grow, both as individuals, and in relationship with the divine. somehow they often appear as frightening and dangerous times, though. Bravo to you for having the courage. :award:

Please do linger around for a while and give folks a chance to get to know you. You might make a lasting friend or two. Several of our members have been more or less precisely where you are now.

Best to you. :pray:

[keltic63]

yes, most definitely! this is the place for you!

I don't often promote my blog here ( I have, and there is a link to it in my signature, but I prefer not to do a lot of promotions here) but there is something I'd like you to read. I think you'll see some similar experiences.

http://keltic.wordpress.com/2007/04/14/i-know-2004/

http://keltic.wordpress.com/2007/10/10/a-reflection-on-national-coming-out-day/

and by all means, let us help you in any way we can. all you got to do is ask.

[Vanessa White]

This place, which feels like a place just as much as my kitchen or my living room at home, is safe, and profound in many ways. I have learned so much about others, and myself, in the time I have been here. Be kind to yourself and ask for what you need. Welcome!! :love:

[status521]

keltic, thanks for the blog sites. these were good, good reading. i will add painful as well.

there truly does seem to be more pain involved in this discovery and acceptance than people realize. having been raised christian and the wrestling match that takes over at times each and everyday is beyond explanation. you add to the fact that in christian circles you typically will lose everything you ever had... does not help matters. the story of your ex outting you is horrific. absolutely. all these things add to the dilemma i find myself in this day, this moment.

will the merry go round ever stop? at times i think no.

it is good to hear, and read of those who have found the ability to bring the ride to a halt and jump on a new one that is more fitting with who they are.

[Pablo Rafael]

Hi Stat,

Glad to have you here with us. I am one of those people who is in a somewhat similar situation to you. I am in the teaching ministry and have taught at Christian schools for 24 years. Right now I am in the "coming out" process. I have come out to everyone except people at work. (I am actually surprised that the news hasn't gotten out at work yet.) I plan on coming out in a couple of months. I am thinking that it will probably cost me my job.

It has been a great relief to be honest with people. Just getting rid of that one secret in my life has been very liberating. It has taken me a long time to get to this point, but I am confident that it is what God has in mind for me.

For me the people on these forums have been a great help. They have given me courage to go forward. They have listened with caring and concern. I am sure they will do the same for you.

Tu Amigo, Pablo

[Zerbie]

Yes, the process can be very painful and even terrifying. That having been said, I believe you will find most folks on the other side of that process will tell you the sense of relief and interior freedom that follows is immense.

Being here is a perfect step towards building a support network of people who will listen, understand, and care as you go through the inside process. You deserve to have friends around you, whether in 3D or in cyber-land who will support you and care about you, whatever you are going through and whatever you decide to do/not do with your future life. I'm glad you're here and are chatting with this bunch - these guys have been there and have a great deal of kindness, as well as perspective, to offer. The point being, it is not *all* pain.

[chuck2pastor]

Wow! I am getting ready to write my first post on this forum, so I thought I'd see what others have written. Your story encourages me to write my own here more fully than I had planned.
Thank you,
Chuck

[tdogg]

Welcome to the forums! Glad you found your way here, and yes, it's the perfect place for you. A safe, loving and interesting haven to talk, take comfort, learn and teach. Awesome!

It's very very hard to come out, especially when the group you are coming out to have no idea and expect something completely opposite. I've been there, done that and still doing it. I have friends and family who don't talk to me anymore, and some that do but it's very strained and held back. But, as difficult and hurtful as this is at times, being out and proud and in the open and myself surrounded by loving, compassionate, supportive and encouraging family and friends, is SO much better than hiding behind a closet door.

That first step, that first coming out is the hardest, and will be repeated as many times as you have people to come out to. I would say, start with those who you feel would be most supportive. Once you have that supportive and encouraging base, it's a little easier to deal with the difficult stuff. And, you always have us if you need a cyber shoulder or just to plain talk or vent. :love:

Welcome!

Tdogg

[HarmlessEccentric]

It is hard and painful. I'm a teacher who took this journey in the summer, and spent my mornings reading about homosexuality in books I borrowed from my library, and my afternoons taking long swims while thinking it all over (if you cry in the pool, it's invisible, did you know?).

For me, it really helped to start attending a welcoming church, where I could see the lives of gay Christians, and how normal, and cheerful, and not tormented they are. The first visit was really scary, but well worth the trouble. It also helped to give myself lots and lots of unstructured time to just think things through and pray, and to join a coming-out support group through my city's GLBT community center.

But I see that you're in the glorious cornfields of Indiana, where such things may not exist... trust me, frequent contact with other gay people will be well worth the drive to your nearest big city.

[status521]

wow. thanks for the encouragement and words of safety all of you have written.

it seems that so often purpose and meaning tend to get lost along the sidelines as the battle rages w/in. strangely, and it is strange, once i connected here yesterday, some of that heavy cloud disapated. don't get me wrong, not a negative or depressed kinda guy. usually upbeat and always swing towards the positive. but it seems that so much has been going on w/ life, job and this issue of sexuality, that a cloud had slowly settled in my thoughts. truly, things were just different once some of the feedback began coming in.

cornfields of indiana... great place to live but also a place of isolation. so much of the time you feel as though you're the only one going through any of this. part of that is lack of ability to talk freely about this side of me w/ anyone w/out some form of condemnation.

it is great to be here.

[andrewlittle]

wow. can't believe i'm here. can't believe i'm doing this. can't believe i have found something in the search for greater meaning.

is this the place for me?

Ooh, baby, is the place for you! Speak your heart, discuss your fears, share your joys - we're a friendly and loving lot.

See you around - well, virtually, at least.

Andy

[Gennee]

Welcome to Soulforce, Status. Your story is very interesting. Many of us have struggled at some point but this is the right place where you can feel comfortable and discover who you are.

Gennee

:love::love::wave:

[paul]

:D. Gotcha.

By now you've discovered the answer to your queery ;).

You are not alone status (you either Chuck). Lots of us were raised in very conservative Christian homes. Me? John MacArthur baptised me. While I no longer consider myself "Christian," many here do. Either way, you will find understanding and acceptance here. You will have to learn how to be open. It will be new and shocking, but very liberating as our resident angle Zerbie points out.

The people here are complex, thoughtful and real. I hope you become one of the family, you are welcome. :wave:.

paul

[Daniel]

as you can read, my situation is sticky... and well... not very rewarding at the moment. all my friends are straight as this side of my life is buried deep. and so i am looking towards this place to be a safe environment to talk, discuss, hopefully gain some people who can bounce things back and forth w/out any judgment or condemnation.

is this the place for me?

Yeah....this is the right place for you. I hope you pull up a chair and stay around a long while.

Your experience and candor about your journey thus far is nothing to be ashamed of. Really. I mean that. We'll all have our learning experiences. And I think it's best to see them as such with as little self-judgment as possible. Guilt never ever helps, does it? It just makes the going a lot tougher.

Being gay in a conservative Christian environment is not for the faint of heart- as I'm sure you know: you are in the thick of it.

And even though you may think you are isolated, you aren't. You've reached out here. And since you've taken this step, and I am sure that there will be others steps.

One at a time.

No need to rush, or press ahead.

This is a great place to hang out and get your bearings. And I look forward to getting you know you better.

Friend.

[paul]

i would like to say i went the healthy route in this discovery, but that would be a lie. i've crawled in more beds than my mind would like to remember. that in itself is very humbling to write.

Status,

Just so you know you are not alone in this...my own experience was similar. I did this as a married man (married to a woman). The fact is, living in a closet can warp us. Sexuality is an appetite. Go to a desert and go without a drink for 2 days and see how much water you guzzle when it becomes available. Repression makes for some unhealthy response. For myself, I found that a healthy response sexually came with accepting myself. One of the greatest ironies of my life is that when I was fighting being gay, I couldn't control the 'gay behavior' (it actually became compulsive for me, long story). Once I stopped fighting that I am gay I am completely able to
make healthy decisions, all compulsion is gone...kinda like magic. Anyway, I didn't want you to feel alone. I applaud your courage and humility.
paul

[status521]

Yeah....this is the right place for you. I hope you pull up a chair and stay around a long while.

Your experience and candor about your journey thus far is nothing to be ashamed of. Really. I mean that. We'll all have our learning experiences. And I think it's best to see them as such with as little self-judgment as possible. Guilt never ever helps, does it? It just makes the going a lot tougher.

Being gay in a conservative Christian environment is not for the faint of heart- as I'm sure you know: you are in the thick of it.

And even though you may think you are isolated, you aren't. You've reached out here. And since you've taken this step, and I am sure that there will be others steps.

One at a time.

No need to rush, or press ahead.

This is a great place to hang out and get your bearings. And I look forward to getting you know you better.

Friend.


Wow. that says it all... this journey is not for the faint of heart. as the battle has raged off and on throughout my life i would have enjoyed fainting... or at least escaping somehow. the irony to the situation is so much of the time in the role i am in, the mantra 'doctor heal thyself' is ever present. if only. you know how many times that has been tried to no avail?the life of a pastor is lonely to begin w/. put in there the sexual issues and it is a desert.

as i have continued to read 'stranger at the gate' (almost finished in 2 days!) i have seen painfully so much of my own life in black and white. many months ago i began writing a book that one day i hope would bring hope for those like myself. it is blatant candor of what goes on w/ the one who struggles so... entitled 'longing' it is all about that. the empty longing of unmet needs and desires that have been pushed down deep. the longing for something more. the longing to be accepted for who i am. i tell that not for self promotion at all, but for the fact i finally found a book in 'stranger' that tells what has been going on for years and years. a stream in the desert has appeared before my eyes like the rock gushing forth water for the israelites.

you're right. it is one step at a time. and one step is how i'll take it.

your words were powerful daniel. very powerful indeed. the chair has been pulled out, a cup of coffee sits at the table as i sit back and converse w/ these new found friends.

[status521]

The fact is, living in a closet can warp us. Sexuality is an appetite. Go to a desert and go without a drink for 2 days and see how much water you guzzle when it becomes available.
Once I stopped fighting that I am gay I am completely able to
make healthy decisions, all compulsion is gone...kinda like magic.

paul
what truth there is to that fact that sexualaity is an appetite. there is much hope given here as i think of your statement to being able to make healthy decisions.... that compulsive behavior is gone. that is something very much to look forward to.

i mean, my gosh, as i threw back the lid to pandora's box, it was all systems go... deal w/ the guilt later... ugly indeed. and is still ugly from time to time if i were honest, which i am w/ this. but to know that these compulsions can wane as things come together is good news to hold onto.

[tdogg]

paul
what truth there is to that fact that sexualaity is an appetite. there is much hope given here as i think of your statement to being able to make healthy decisions.... that compulsive behavior is gone. that is something very much to look forward to.

i mean, my gosh, as i threw back the lid to pandora's box, it was all systems go... deal w/ the guilt later... ugly indeed. and is still ugly from time to time if i were honest, which i am w/ this. but to know that these compulsions can wane as things come together is good news to hold onto.

To take responsibility is mature, and more people should do that. Try to stay away from the guilt, it pulls one down. And, were this an open and compassionate world to live in generally, I'm sure you would have handled this in an entirely different way. Sometimes, our actions are desires combined with social, political and cultural restraints placed on us for very bad reasons. Know you are as worthy as any other person, no less loved by your God. Take comfort in the wonderful creation that is YOU. :love:

[status521]

so i awoke this morning w/ a start. the dream was vivid. real. the whole concept of the dream is not as important as how it ended: i was some director or something for a news program and was behind the camera watching as what dialogue unfolded... all the anchors were rushing off to some large party... a beautiful woman stood there talking about what the evening was going to be like, when the male getting around to leave stated, "look. God is not merciful. He is not of grace. There is no grace or mercy with Him. This is an illusion... a myth."

i woke up.

strange, huh?

i have not been able to shake these words all day. as i prepared to go to church, looked back over my sunday school lesson, prepared to 'do my thing' - these words echoed throughout my mind.

[Zerbie]

Wow. I would think that would be an unsettling dream.

We don't know you so we can't guess what it "means," but tell us (if you don't mind the question,) do those words at the end of the dream reflect some fear you have that they just *might* be true?

[keltic63]

so i awoke this morning w/ a start. the dream was vivid. real. the whole concept of the dream is not as important as how it ended: i was some director or something for a news program and was behind the camera watching as what dialogue unfolded... all the anchors were rushing off to some large party... a beautiful woman stood there talking about what the evening was going to be like, when the male getting around to leave stated, "look. God is not merciful. He is not of grace. There is no grace or mercy with Him. This is an illusion... a myth."

i woke up.

strange, huh?

i have not been able to shake these words all day. as i prepared to go to church, looked back over my sunday school lesson, prepared to 'do my thing' - these words echoed throughout my mind.

Wow. I would think that would be an unsettling dream.

We don't know you so we can't guess what it "means," but tell us (if you don't mind the question,) do those words at the end of the dream reflect some fear you have that they just *might* be true?

my thoughts exactly.

I've been paying attention to my dreams, and in particular those dreams in which my departed grandmother appears. they are so very real to me, and I am convinced that she is bringing me messages. is the message of this dream a tape that plays in your head, a message, perhaps of your own making, that you are not worthy of God's mercy and grace? perhaps because of the burden you've carried you have missed the glory of God's mercy and grace and now you fear that it is not there for you?

when you've come out into the sunshine, I assure you, God's grace and mercy will flow for you. My worst day since being out can never compare to my easiest day hiding in the closet.

[Daniel]

If I may- I would like to offer this dream interpretation.

The female in the room is your intuition- your inner feminine- Sophia- as she is called in the East. She's anticipating- waiting- for the party to begin- that is- your transformation.

The male is the part of your mind that 'logics' things out. He represents all that you fear- the changes that will unfold.

All this aside, the really great thing about the dream is that you are the director. You get to decide which voice to listen to. The voice of fear, or the voice of Love.

My advice: listen to Sophia. Go to the Party.

[Zerbie]

If I may- I would like to offer this dream interpretation.

The female in the room is your intuition- your inner feminine- Sophia- as she is called in the East. She's anticipating- waiting- for the party to begin- that is- your transformation.

The male is the part of your mind that 'logics' things out. He represents all that you fear- the changes that will unfold.

All this aside, the really great thing about the dream is that you are the director. You get to decide which voice to listen to. The voice of fear, or the voice of Love.

My advice: listen to Sophia. Go to the Party.

:weee: :lol:

I too was struck by the gendered casting of this dream. We tend to view intellect and thought process as gendered masculine, so that is why I asked if this might be some way-old fear you've been carrying. Leave it to the rational Arguer, masculine mind, to make a thesis statement.

Just another thought to take or leave as you wish.
:cool:

[status521]

gosh, you guys are spot on here. thanks zerbie, keltic and daniel for your thoughts. especially the concept of the gender roles present and what they represent. man, gonna need to think on this a bit.

okay, here's the story... you know, the getting to know me better really. this whole concept of grace and mercy are something i wrestle w/ all the time w/ God. all the time. easy to encourage others to believe in it, but when it comes to your own life --- well, a tough pill to swallow. i'm sure you all know the routine, we just know ourselves and know our ticks, our struggles, etc... and attempting to figure out that God loves us anyway in the midst of it is something difficult to wrap our minds or even dare i say i our wills around.

i believe this dream came out of this past week having discovered soulforce. i really do. through this forum, through personal pm's from a few of you something has happened. for the first time i feel as though it's okay to be me... and see where that leads... you know? and in truth, it was one of the better weeks i've had in a long time. w/ that of course comes looking at life a bit differently. i suppose in the back of my mind still is the never ending saga of wondering of His grace.

wow. grappling w/ that --- well, hmm... the journey has begun. but that said.... daniel, i've got the party invitation in hand... i'm on my way.

[Daniel]

Something tells me that you are going to be having some interesting dreams to mull over....


gosh, you guys are spot on here. thanks zerbie, keltic and daniel for your thoughts. especially the concept of the gender roles present and what they represent. man, gonna need to think on this a bit.

okay, here's the story... you know, the getting to know me better really. this whole concept of grace and mercy are something i wrestle w/ all the time w/ God. all the time. easy to encourage others to believe in it, but when it comes to your own life --- well, a tough pill to swallow. i'm sure you all know the routine, we just know ourselves and know our ticks, our struggles, etc... and attempting to figure out that God loves us anyway in the midst of it is something difficult to wrap our minds or even dare i say i our wills around.

A term comes to mind here: internalized homophobia. We don't give ourselve's a break even though we may know the drill as it pertains to others. We can see them in the light of Grace. But ourselves? That can be harder to do, especially when someone has taught us that their love is conditional on their approval: their homophobia becomes our homophobia and we hardly even know it.....

i believe this dream came out of this past week having discovered soulforce. i really do. through this forum, through personal pm's from a few of you something has happened. for the first time i feel as though it's okay to be me... and see where that leads... you know? and in truth, it was one of the better weeks i've had in a long time. w/ that of course comes looking at life a bit differently. i suppose in the back of my mind still is the never ending saga of wondering of His grace.

It's more than ok for you to be you: you are uncovering or discovering the real you which has been there all along.

And the eyes of the blind shall be opened....and the ears of the deaf unstopped.

wow. grappling w/ that --- well, hmm... the journey has begun. but that said.... daniel, i've got the party invitation in hand... i'm on my way.

Party on!

[Zerbie]

I'd like to send you some of these: :love::love::love:

There, done. :cool: Now, below:


this whole concept of grace and mercy are something i wrestle w/ all the time w/ God. all the time. easy to encourage others to believe in it, but when it comes to your own life --- well, a tough pill to swallow. i'm sure you all know the routine, we just know ourselves and know our ticks, our struggles, etc... and attempting to figure out that God loves us anyway in the midst of it is something difficult to wrap our minds or even dare i say i our wills around.

((( Stat ))) :love:

If grace and mercy are difficult to believe in, what might you expect in their stead? Abandonment? Punishment??
:(:(

May I ask directly? Are these fears related to being gay? Or are they more generalized than that?

If it is related to being gay, then I am with Daniel: internalized homophobia. Do a search on the term on this forum's search function, and you will find some of our stories.

For whatever it might be worth, God cannot abandon you. The love that he has for you will always bring his arms rushing to enfold you in gentleness. He cannot do otherwise, he IS that divine love.
:dove::dove::dove:







i believe this dream came out of this past week having discovered soulforce. i really do. through this forum, through personal pm's from a few of you something has happened. for the first time i feel as though it's okay to be me... and see where that leads... you know? and in truth, it was one of the better weeks i've had in a long time.

:):love:
I am so glad.
Yes. It is okay. You are safe here.
It is now important to make your inner heart a safe sanctuary for your true self.


w/ that of course comes looking at life a bit differently. i suppose in the back of my mind still is the never ending saga of wondering of His grace.
.

If God is God, then he knew who you would be when he made you. Obviously he loved you enough to make you and imbue you with love, so, imo, there's the answer.
:love:
:love:

You are loved and wanted. (and that includes here.)

[Vanessa White]

You know, Status, the exciting, loving part of the journey that you are now on, is that we are ALL on it. There is so much learning and growing going on at this place at any given moment it is almost incomprehensible. Sure, we are all at different parts of the path, and sometimes we stumble, and go back, sometimes we run ahead, sometimes we sit on a bench that we find along the way. But we always do it while knowing we have one another to support, cajole, cheer up, kick in the butt, and just BE with.

I have made some of the best friends of my current life here. I bring burdens and joys of my heart here more willingly than to those in 3D at times!!! You are definitely safe, welcome, and among friends here. :love::love:

[Jennifer5]

Welcome!! :)