New Ted Haggard news

[Matt Algren]

I'm looking for a silver lining on this. On the one hand, he's lending false credibility to the ex-gay industry. On the other, maybe putting this familiar a face on what (to most reasonable people) is obviously a lie will help point out the silliness inherent of the whole point of view and pull people who would normally be laissez faire to our side of the argument.

[Daniel]

Haggard's thinking is plainly revealed in a interview in the LATimes.

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/show...th-ted-ha.html

Q: Do you think it is a sin to be gay?

A: Well, I think the Bible reveals many ideals that God has for us, and I think God’s ideal for us is that we express our sexuality in monogamous, heterosexual relationships. But I know that humanity is complex, and so even though that is the ideal, I understand that there is the great deal of diversity. But I think all of us need to keep growing and developing. So I would say to a gay man or a straight man or a bisexual man to continue seeking God, continue reading the Scriptures, continue to stay in fellowship with other believers who are willing to grow in God’s plans for their lives, and let God by his spirit and his word work it out. But I would never preach to somebody else the same conclusions I’ve come to myself. For me, for me, I have a set of standards from the Scripture, and other people have to establish their own sense of standards from the Scriptures, as they read them.

Makes total sense that he would want to see himself as a straight man with issues. After all, God's plan, according to Haggard (and his therapist?) is for every man to be straight.

[philip3gw]

Is this guy trying to profit for his "transgressions"? Oprah, ABC News, and Nightline. We had a state legislator down the road from me who voted against gay rights and was caught having sex with a male escort. He has falling out of the social and political scene along with his wife. Teddy should too!

[alphie]

from watching Oprah today - I think Ted is probably Bisexual and I think he has come along way in his journey. What do you all think about his Oprah interview?

[Rick336]

Originally Posted by Daniel

Please! Who buys this Reparative Therapy crap?

The same people who believe donkeys can talk.

Rick

[Zerbie]

Originally Posted by Rick336

The same people who believe donkeys can talk.

Rick

Donkeys do talk.
We just don't understand them.

(Sorry for being OT, guys, I just had to interject.)

[wmanion]

I watched the documentary about Ted Haggard on HBO last night and I could actually see that he was hurt that the church exiled him and that he is no longer welcome, and can never serve in that church again. However, he still does not see. I am a believer in the "reap what you sew," philosophy and I wish that he could see that everything he feels about the church turning their back on him is the same thing he has been making the GLBT community feel for years. We have been exiled from the church (although many are starting to change) and now he is feeling what we have been feeling for years. I just wish he could relate.

Bill

[Daniel]

For Haggard to really 'get' gay people, and what he has put them through, he would have to come to grips with his worldview, which, from what I have seen, he is in no hurry to do. He is still very much invested in being 'Ted Haggard' preacher man.

[Rick336]

Ted Haggard is trapped in an evangelical lifestyle and needs intense therapy to get him to live as a normal gay man.

Rick

[Rick336]

Originally Posted by Zerbie

Donkeys do talk.
We just don't understand them.

I'm not sure what your point is, but my point is that it is impossible for donkeys to have conversations with human beings in a human language. People who believe the Bible is the infallible word of God must also believe that donkeys can speak a human language as the one did in Numbers 22:27-28.

Many of these same people also believe that mental telepathy to an invisible man can magically cure homosexuality. This, I believe, is also impossible. If it was possible, then why stop at homosexuality? Why not cure cancer and end starvation too? Why worry about homosexuals when millions of children are dying in Africa?

Rick

[keltic63]

Originally Posted by Rick336

Ted Haggard is trapped in an evangelical lifestyle and needs intense therapy to get him to live as a normal gay man.

Rick

if you're saying this "tongue-in-cheek" it is much closer to the truth than you could ever imagine!

if you're saying this seriously, then let me agree with you again, this time 100%. I've seen people living this "christian evangelical" lifestyle. I think there is pressure on the church members to conform and live like everyone else that goes to that particular church. For instance, one of the expected behaviors is that after attending worship on Sunday morning, the christian will go out to eat at a "family" type restaurant, a place that is not too expensive, serves huge servings of comfort food, OR has a buffet. while there, the christians are expected to offer a prayer for their food, just loud enough for others to see how spiritual they are, and then they indulge in the sin of gluttony.

[christa08]

http://news.aol.com/article/haggard-...ics-not/323450

"He pretty much asked me if it was OK if he masturbated in front of me or masturbated in the bed next to me," Haas said. "I told him no, it would make me really uncomfortable. But he grabbed a bottle of lotion and started masturbating."

I feel really bad for Haas. I can't even imagine what must've been going through his mind when this happened. Much less, what was Ted Haggard thinking? This is disgusting! ...and very very creepy

[Rick336]

Originally Posted by keltic63

While there, the christians are expected to offer a prayer for their food, just loud enough for others to see how spiritual they are, and then they indulge in the sin of gluttony.

Many in the Christian Right say that homosexuality is "repulsive". But what I find repulsive is the blatant hypocrisy of many fundamentalist Christians like the example you gave above.

Hypocrisy equals dishonesty. In fact, to say that one believes one thing and then does the opposite is the epitome of dishonesty and is typical of many fundamentalist Christians. To say, "I believe the Holy Scripture is God's law that we should all follow," and then ignore most of scripture is hypocritical. The fact that such behavior continues on such a great scale is, to me, repulsive.

It's no wonder the fundamentalist Christians say they get no respect. It's difficult for many people to respect that way of thinking.

Rick

[Zerbie]

Originally Posted by wmanion

I watched the documentary about Ted Haggard on HBO last night and I could actually see that he was hurt that the church exiled him and that he is no longer welcome, and can never serve in that church again. However, he still does not see. I am a believer in the "reap what you sew," philosophy and I wish that he could see that everything he feels about the church turning their back on him is the same thing he has been making the GLBT community feel for years. We have been exiled from the church (although many are starting to change) and now he is feeling what we have been feeling for years. I just wish he could relate.

Bill

The barrier to him understanding that is that he sees himself as very different from 'the gay community.'

[Zerbie]

Originally Posted by Rick336

I'm not sure what your point is, but my point is that it is impossible for donkeys to have conversations with human beings in a human language. People who believe the Bible is the infallible word of God must also believe that donkeys can speak a human language as the one did in Numbers 22:27-28.

Rick

It was a joke, Rick.
A joke which also was to remind us that we humans must not be quite so smart if dogs and other pets can understand a few words of our language, but we can't understand anything that animals say when they call out.

That's why I apologized for going so far off topic.

[Rick336]

Originally Posted by Zerbie

It was a joke, Rick.
A joke which also was to remind us that we humans must not be quite so smart if dogs and other pets can understand a few words of our language, but we can't understand anything that animals say when they call out.

That's why I apologized for going so far off topic.

Oops. Sorry. I see now that it was meant as humor. Sometimes I'm a little slow.


Rick

[tdogg]

Originally Posted by Zerbie

A joke which also was to remind us that we humans must not be quite so smart if dogs and other pets can understand a few words of our language, but we can't understand anything that animals say when they call out.

At the risk of going off topic, I actually can understand some of what the animals say. They don't speak in human language, but their is slightly understandable if one takes the time to 'connect' with them. This isn't limited to my pets, but more apt to happen with them.

The Haggard story is sad. Because other lives were affected. Mainly because Haggard's religious beliefs are the cause for his misery, and that of so many other people. When folks concentrate on the ugly, scary, hateful parts of religion made up by humans, they forget the beautiful, loving and kind parts fueled by love for God and all living things. I feel sorry for this man and the others he hurt. I hope he finds peace with who he is, instead of continuing to hurt others and spread this kind of misery.

[Zerbie]

Originally Posted by tdogg

At the risk of going off topic, I actually can understand some of what the animals say. They don't speak in human language, but their is slightly understandable if one takes the time to 'connect' with them. This isn't limited to my pets, but more apt to happen with them.


I am not surprised. I would expect you to have an empathic connection with animals. Hubby is like that, too. He 'reads' their communication signals very well. Heck -- animals are always approaching him. Animals, and little children, just love him and are always gravitating.

For most people, I believe 'reading' the communications from animals is not so much something they invest in. Pet-owners and sometimes others have a talent for it, and when I had a dog, I recognized the difference in sound between his "I want water" bark, his "I want a walk" bark, and his "There is a stranger at the door" bark. But on the whole, it seems animals are more apt to understand what we are saying to them, than the other way around.

Regarding Rick's donkey comment, it occurred to me yesterday that there's a way of defending the literal interpretation of that donkey episode. Just claim that the person the donkey was talking to was gifted by God with the ability to understand the braying of donkeys.



The Haggard story is sad. Because other lives were affected. Mainly because Haggard's religious beliefs are the cause for his misery, and that of so many other people. When folks concentrate on the ugly, scary, hateful parts of religion made up by humans, they forget the beautiful, loving and kind parts fueled by love for God and all living things. I feel sorry for this man and the others he hurt. I hope he finds peace with who he is, instead of continuing to hurt others and spread this kind of misery.

Well, maybe I feel a bit sad for Haggard. It's complicated by the fact that he has engaged in actions which harm many other people, and whatever feeling I had has been greatly diluted by his behavior of lapping up media attention. That's a turn-off. The more he keeps that up, the harder an internal U-turn is going to be, because he's putting bricks in his wall.