Will I ever get over her?

[pnggrad79]

I don't know what to think anymore. I loved this woman for the better part of half my life so far. I don't know if I loved who I wanted her to be, and the stark reality is that she is a narcissistic control freak with avoidance issues, and too demanding and self centered. When I get to missing her I ask myself do I miss all that? Do I miss constantly being made to feel second to everything else she wanted? Do I miss being lied to? Do I miss being told "I will never leave you" and then leaving me 5 times for dumbass reasons? Do I miss her really? Or do I miss what I wanted?

I wanted a love that lasted forever. I know that is a little pie in the sky but I wanted it nonetheless. I thought she meant what she said. I thought she loved me. She said she did, many times, but I guess it wasn't enough. I never could please her. I never could do enough to make her want to stay. But should I have to?

Will I ever get over her? Since she probably was an illusion in my head, I hope that I do. I want to love someone, and I want to be loved. I don't want to be controlled, manipulated, lied to, left, thrown away and discarded. Is that too much to ask?

[Victoria]

I picked up a term somewhere, from a Sci Fi show, and expanded on the idea, for myself.
Neural Clone
We have Neural Clones of ~everyone~ we've ever known, cared about, feared, and even objects, a table, chair, etc... in our minds... in this sense, we have a Neural Copy of Every Single Thing, Object, Beings or even Idea, of what we've been exposed to, in our lives.

These mental constructs can heal us, or harm us... I have one of my Therapist, that I talk to, in a little office in my head, when I can see her, and I'm struggling with something... and she does much the same as in her Actual office... Sits there and lets me bounce ideas off of her, while occasionally putting a little spin on them, and sending them back, so I can think about them a different way... That's a Healing "Clone".

I have had, in the past, Harmful clones... Copies of people who have hurt me and Harmed me that, in a very real sense, have caused me to become ~addicted~ to that hurt... Growing up the way I did, I knew about, and understood, ~Abuse~ far better than I ever did ~Love~, and while these little clones ran around in my head, hurting me further, I continued to keep getting involved in ~similar~ relationships, that continually proved that... "this is all there is, for me". Self-fulfilling Prophecies, while I let people control me, even though they ~really~ only existed, by that time, in my imagination, even after I Physically left them behind.

Another concept that can be related, that's often spoke of in a similar sense, is "Facing your Personal Demons"... but ~any~ kind of demon, only has the power over you, that you, yourself, give it.

It's gonna hurt, you really can't avoid suffering. Trying to do so, only makes it worse... and the ~Worst~ way to "try to avoid suffering" is getting stuck in the mindset, that you're only suffering ~now~ because you ~left~ the situation that, in reality, ~caused~ you suffering, in the first place. That's the addictive behavior you need to overcome. And like all addictions, you're gonna have withdrawals.

Trust that you know she's Poison to you, ~even when~ some parts of you keep Lying and Telling you that you ~Need~ that poison, in order to stop hurting. You made the right choice, a ~courageous~ choice, to end an abusive relationship, whether she initiated the end, or not, it's ~Your~ choice, ~Alone~ to make it the ~Right~ one.

Courage is when you Make, and Keep Making, the Right Choice, no matter how much it hurts, and no matter how much you're afraid. And just trust, until you get there, that when you come out the other side, you're gonna look back, and smile, and wonder, what the Hell ever kept me there, in the first place?

Learn to love ~you~, before you know what loving ~someone else~ is really like.

=)

~V~

[RedneckDyke]

When you've been with somebody for a long time it takes a long time to heal from a breakup. Try not to think of long term stuff like "will i ever". Just try to go day by day. Don't feel guilty about the way you feel. Missing somebody sucks. Take care of yourself first. Do something that YOU really like. Take yourself out. You get to pick the movie and decide what to eat.

[BrianB]

Is it possible that you had a fantasy of what she should be like? Then when she was just herself you felt rejected, disappointed, hurt, deceived? That is what happened with my ex. I had a dream of what she should be like. When she behaved like herself I felt like she had lied to me. Made promises she couldn't keep. Sure, we had many good times; but the bad times started to outweigh the good. My advice is try to remember the good about her and let the rest fade into the past. Time really does make the pain hurt less.

[pnggrad79]

Is it time or just our brains way of shutting out the pain and developing emotional amnesia? I really would like to forget I ever knew her. So much pain, torment, emotional rollercoaster and deception. Victoria, you are right, I need to love me before I can love anyone else. I deserve better than the abuse she dished out.

[Victoria]

Originally Posted by pnggrad79

Is it time or just our brains way of shutting out the pain and developing emotional amnesia? I really would like to forget I ever knew her. So much pain, torment, emotional rollercoaster and deception. Victoria, you are right, I need to love me before I can love anyone else. I deserve better than the abuse she dished out.

Telling yourself that is a start... but when you start to doubt that it's true, you start backsliding ~lol~

I had to, for a long time, constantly remind myself of how ~hurtful~ the relationship was to me, how ~abusive~ my wife was... in order to keep myself above the backsliding attempts to go back to her... and it ~hurts even more~ sometimes, to remember that stuff, while blocking out the ~good~ stuff... it's hard, and it hurts, but it's not an impossible task.

I'm sorry you're hurting so much, and I hope and pray for you, that it passes soon ~hugz~

~V~

[Victoria]

Originally Posted by BrianB

Is it possible that you had a fantasy of what she should be like? Then when she was just herself you felt rejected, disappointed, hurt, deceived? That is what happened with my ex. I had a dream of what she should be like. When she behaved like herself I felt like she had lied to me. Made promises she couldn't keep. Sure, we had many good times; but the bad times started to outweigh the good. My advice is try to remember the good about her and let the rest fade into the past. Time really does make the pain hurt less.

This, too, fits in with another aspect of my "neural clone" ideas... In different ways, I can see how, in my ~own~ life, I read stories, watch movies, saw other people in loving relationships, and I developed an image in my own mind, of the person ~I~ wanted to be with... and too often, that image I sort of "mapped onto" every person I tried to be with... and ~instead of finding~ such a person, it ends up working ~against~ being able to find such a person...

We end up trying to force people into a mold, of our ~own~ design, and "love" an "object" we've developed inside ourselves, that we can control, define, and limit... rather than love the person who we're ~with~ for ~themselves~, the way ~they~ were made... Selfish love, instead of Open love.

I struggle with this in a similar way, myself, now. Some of my family has this idea in their heads of who I am, who they've ~known~ me to be, because I was always too afraid to tell them before, like about my transgender identities... and, for now, it's somehow easier for them to think I've "just gone crazy" because to ~them~, it's new, and out of nowhere... while, to me, it's fresh, and alive, and has been with me every day of my life...

and I ~want~ to talk to them, and have them talk to me, about this stuff, but they don't want to right now... and it's hard for me to tell where to draw the line of letting them choose for themselves, how to be themselves, and at what point to I stop trying, and simply cut them out of my life... else risk that ~I~ try to push ~my~ ideas of what I want ~them~ to be like... Open and Accepting... from my point of view... but fear of supporting me in a "mental illness" from theirs... How can I tell which is true? And where do I draw the lines in decide what sort of treatment I will tolerate, and how much, before I leave them behind? To me, what they're doing is abusive, and to them, what they're doing is "helping"... which is why I can forgive what they do, to some extent... but it's still hard, sometimes, when I start worrying over much that... maybe they're right...

Still working on it, I guess =P

[pnggrad79]

I hear what you are saying Brian and Victoria, I guess I did create some kind of fantasy of who I wanted them to be. I know I did that with my first husband, he was definitely an illusion I created and when I came face to face with the reality of who he is, I discovered I didn't like him, much less love him.

With her it was different in that I had no prescribed notions of who I wanted her to be. I knew what I was walking into when I got into the relationship. I guess the fantasy was that I wanted her to be happy with just me, because I was happy with just her. I had no other desires. But she wanted to be a successful entrepreneur and make lots of money, and she wanted children. I was ok with both of those projects and sometimes felt they were more important than me. I guess the fantasy was I wanted her to be happy while doing those things, but love me too. I think she didn't see that loving me was going to further her agenda. And she can be very intense when she is thwarted. I think she saw me as a roadblock to her dreams and wishes. Maybe I don't know what the hell I am talking about.

I know after yesterday I really am seeing who she is and that I need to let her go to find whatever it is that makes her happy. Evidently she can't just love me. Evidently, I was spinning my wheels hoping that I would be enough and I wasn't. Never was.

I do love her and hate her at the same time. I need to get over her and move on and let someone love me and me love someone for who they are and not the fantasy I create about it.

I am tired and have spent 31 years trying desperately to mold them into what I wanted and it was a dismal failure. It is real easy to lapse into catastrophic thinking here and my mind is all too ready to do that.

There is a song that Casting Crowns sings called "Voice of Truth"
The chorus goes:

But the Voice of Truth tells me a different story
The Voice of Truth says do not be afraid
The Voice of Truth says this is for my glory
Out of all the voices calling out to me
I will choose to listen and believe the Voice of Truth

That song has spoken to me volumes of what I need to hear.

[pnggrad79]

I just can't believe all the lies she told me! I found a card she gave me not long after we "reconciled" that said she appreciated the efforts I was making and to hold on tight and we would have a great life together. She said she loved and adored me. How could she write those things and not mean them? How could she promise me over and over again she wouldn't leave me, and she did? Why?

I just don't get it. Am I dealing with a narcissistic liar who has control issues and commitment phobia? I couldn't look someone in the eye and knowingly tell them something like what she said, and it not be true.

Why do I fall for stupidity like this? Why am I the damn fool who fell in love with her? Moreover, where do I go from her?

I hate this pain, I hate the lies, I hate the way she ran me over and left me to pick up the pieces of my heart ONCE MORE!!!!

[Victoria]

Originally Posted by pnggrad79

I just can't believe all the lies she told me! I found a card she gave me not long after we "reconciled" that said she appreciated the efforts I was making and to hold on tight and we would have a great life together. She said she loved and adored me. How could she write those things and not mean them? How could she promise me over and over again she wouldn't leave me, and she did? Why?

I have a deep and abiding faith in God, that I can't give you... but I can give you a perspective on how to look at such things, if you're willing to open your mind a little to the idea.

All the Love in the world comes from God. All the fear and hurt comes from within ourselves... These things she wrote, all the love and truth you saw in them, come from God, and/or the part of her who she might have been, if the world wasn't so frigged up.

All the other stuff, the stuff that hurt, came from with ~her~, from ~her~ own hurt, and, without knowing any other way to express it, she expressed it "on you".

Now it's on ~you~ to take responsibility for what she put on you. It's not you fault, but it is your problem, and you have everything you need to find a solution to it.

She said she loved and adored me. How could she write those things and not mean them?

Regardless of this girls personal issues, God would say that to you, and mean it, if you could hear Him... So... seems to me that's one of the ways He was trying to tell you, knowing the hurt that was coming to you, to remind you, that even though this girl you're hurting for didn't, ~He did, and still does~.

I can say that with certainty because I ~also~ love you, and hurt for you, and with you, because I, too, know how you feel, even if I don't know the exact circumstances, nor have the same details, I know how much, how deeply, and how seemingly lost one can be, trapped in that tiny box, like an Iron Maiden, so that no matter how one tries to move, or escape, or just get a little ~break~ from the pain... there's another spike stabbing into ones heart, mind, and sometimes it feels... into our very ~being~...

but you know there's hope, because you can see some of us, ~outside~ that box, ~past~ the times when we hurt, as you do now... just try to think outside that box, a little at a time, knowing it doesn't last forever.

Love and ~hugz~,

~V~

[pnggrad79]

I hope it doesn't last forever, but how long will it take for me to not feel this terrible hurt and anger inside for all the lies and betrayal she has done to me?

[Victoria]

However long it takes for you to get ~through~ it. Just don't stuff it down, and hide it, else it'll just come back again.

Start realizing that you're ~not~ alone. So many people suffer, and have suffered, in this same way, and there are ~so~ many answers out there for you to find, and make work, for ~yourself~...

Because you can't read my mind, I can't simply project my answers, into you, and because of the vagaries and varieties of Language, and all the different ways of saying the ~same thing~, you can't simply read one source and expect to have all the answers from it. You can research the Psychology of Abuse, including the ideas of co-dependency, and learning how when we abuse each other, we end up, later, abusing others as we have been. Hurting People, Hurt People. Think of how much hurt your ~ex~ must be in, and have lived through, in order to have the capacity to hurt you, as she did. You can read of ~other~ peoples hurts, like ~you~ have, and how ~they~ have found to deal with it, themselves, and extrapolate from those things how ~you~ might be able to work things, ~your~way.

But... I know of ~One~ source that has ~all~ the answers, but not everyone is Christian, and even those who say they are, often aren't... but you don't have to be, in order to ~ask~. Just having the knowledge that ~you~ hurt, ~you~ suffer, and you ~know~ Others do, also, if not as much, or even worse, sometimes... Ask God to teach you, and raise you out of suffering, Ask the Universe, Ask ~yourself~, if you must, they are all part of the same...

And we all gotta start somewhere =)

Right now, you understand the Absence of Love, because you not only ~feel~ it, you ~notice~ you feel it. You may not have noticed it, before, except in small ways... and as you keep looking for answers, ones that are True, that we were ~never~ meant to hurt each other the ways we do, you'll also start to learn it's not ~her~ fault, either... and when you can understand ~why~... you'll end your suffering, for all time. Once you're aware of yourself, that much, that you are not alone in your suffering... you start to share it, without even realizing it.

Don't run away from it, run ~into~ it, ~knowing~ you'll come out safe, on the other side of it... Stronger and with more Understanding, so that ~you~ can help others, Later, who feel the ways you do, Now.

Love yourself ~that much~, just to start... Then you'll be able to see how you can ~share~ that Love with others, and have it returned, without ever having to ask, Just like in the song you quote ~hugz~

Love,

~V~

[scott snedeker]

Originally Posted by pnggrad79

I hope it doesn't last forever, but how long will it take for me to not feel this terrible hurt and anger inside for all the lies and betrayal she has done to me?

My break=up with my emotionally f--ked-up and abusive Ex of 12 years was first characterized by a continuous angst that never let up! 8 months later whenever I came home from work to my house it felt like I found my dog hanging dead on the porch!

I realized that I had to change this mindset. The first thing I did was call the local auctioneer and told him to empty every room of everything except one. In that one room I placed a new mattress on the floor and put a few of my clothes, some things I had before I met him, a new alarm clock and a new cheap lamp.

He cleaned out the house and sold everything for $3000.00 With that money I had the house repainted, recarpeted and cleaned and put it up for sale.

The house sold in three weeks as I priced it below market value and bought a new car.

I moved into a furnished rental and started a new life.

The physical attachment of the house, car and belongings were dragging me back to the Identity of the failed abused martyr that I was for my Ex.

I see now that he was just a damaged suffering soul, but He was extremely toxic to me.

Years later I can feel compassion for him.

I bought a derelict barn on 8 acres with a grove of beautiful oaks and a spring-fed lake. I converted the barn into a funky artistic bungalow over 4 years while I slept on a mattress on the floor of the old bunkhouse which had an outdoor shower and outdoor kitchen.

I began to raise exotic animals for collectors and zoos. I had several Bunk Buddies who were also in transition who either shared the bunkhouse with me or camped under the trees.

The four most important are now my lovers. We formed a family-commune. Eventually two moved away and two stayed. Together we all learned that love is something to share.

We learned that possession and monogamy are the opposite of love. Our circle of folk with whom we share intimate love with is huge now, more that 30 people.

That is when I Joined the Radical Faeries and the Short Mountain Sanctuary.

PNgrad, I am only 3 years younger than you. There is a wonderful life ahead of you. There are people to love and people you need and who need you to grow and heal.

Close the door on this nightmare that you mistook for a dream, and open a new door to living.

[pnggrad79]

I am glad Scottie that you were able to do that. And do it so well, my friend. Sounds like you got rid of a lot of the cobwebs and were able to convert old things into new and it helped heal your broken heart.

I have not seen her for a month tomorrow, and I haven't cried about her in days. I don't really miss her all that much. She was too high maintenance and I am done with high maintenance people. I see my life heading in a new direction and although I don't have the answers, I feel good for the first time in a very long time.

I don't have to be saddled with a newborn at the age of 50. I don't have to worry about her ever leaving me again and the emotional exhaustion that causes. I don't have to worry about jumping through hoops to please a person who constantly changes the rules and then doesn't bother to let you know what rules have been changed and then holds you strictly to them.

It will take awhile to heal but I feel good and like I am on the road to a new life. I am going back to school to work on my Masters and who knows where that will take me.

I am done with her and with that life. I look back at journals I kept and wonder why I stayed so long. She was always impossible to please and although I love her and possibly always will, it isn't enough to make a relationship with her again. I just can't cross over that line and trust her. She hasn't earned it. Not sure I would stay around long enough for her to earn it. Not sure she could ever make restitution for the years of heartbreak and soul hurt she has caused.

I want someone who loves me and doesn't try to make me into a clone of them. Is that so unreasonable?

[KevinW]

I've been through this same thing and dealing with it for the past three years.

Three years ago, I proposed to my closest friend. He was the only person I've ever been able to totally trust and who I had more than just a physical crush on. For the first time in my life, I felt totally attracted to somebody. We'd shared a lot of the same interests and pasttimes, and after a lot of thought, I decided to just come out and propose to him. He admitted that he'd known for some time that I was attracted to him as more than just a friend, and he just wanted to take things slow to see how they went.

A little over a month afterward, I discovered why he wanted to take things slow when I ran into his ex on either MySpace or Facebook. At the time I'd proposed, his ex had been back living with him, and they'd been hiding it for some time from me.

Needless to say, I was devastated. He downplayed it at the time and said that he and his ex were just roommates, that it was just temporary, and that he hadn't said anything because he knew I'd get upset. I tried remaining just friends with him, but over time he's grown more and more distant. Plus, his ex is still living there, and his ex keeps posting online how they're together. Obviously, somebody's not telling the truth.

One of my new year's resolutions was to try to move on and not get held back by the negative stuff from my past. My friend, I feel, has been one of those things. About three weeks ago, I unfriended him on Facebook and Myspace. He hasn't even asked what was up with that, which, to me, has confirmed my suspicions. It still hurts at times when I think of him or see a guy who reminds me of him, but I'm moving on with my life since I do have a lot going for me and am currently working on starting my own business so that I can quit my current job.

Kevin

[BruceChris]

You've got friends here that hear your pain, care about you, and will probably pray for you. And you can bellyache all you want. We care about you.

BruceChris

[scott snedeker]

Originally Posted by pnggrad79

I am glad Scottie that you were able to do that. And do it so well, my friend. Sounds like you got rid of a lot of the cobwebs and were able to convert old things into new and it helped heal your broken heart.

I have not seen her for a month tomorrow, and I haven't cried about her in days. I don't really miss her all that much. She was too high maintenance and I am done with high maintenance people. I see my life heading in a new direction and although I don't have the answers, I feel good for the first time in a very long time.

I don't have to be saddled with a newborn at the age of 50. I don't have to worry about her ever leaving me again and the emotional exhaustion that causes. I don't have to worry about jumping through hoops to please a person who constantly changes the rules and then doesn't bother to let you know what rules have been changed and then holds you strictly to them.
It will take awhile to heal but I feel good and like I am on the road to a new life. I am going back to school to work on my Masters and who knows where that will take me.

I am done with her and with that life. I look back at journals I kept and wonder why I stayed so long. She was always impossible to please and although I love her and possibly always will, it isn't enough to make a relationship with her again. I just can't cross over that line and trust her. She hasn't earned it. Not sure I would stay around long enough for her to earn it. Not sure she could ever make restitution for the years of heartbreak and soul hurt she has caused.

I want someone who loves me and doesn't try to make me into a clone of them. Is that so unreasonable?

Wow!

I can hear the change in your tone! I can hear your conscious awareness awakening!

Great job! I know it wasn't easy or over yet.

There is a Dutch proverb:

"Once you are outside the door, you already have a great deal of the journey behind you."

Kudos! for walking out and closing the door.!

She will likely find another person to psycho-drama torture for gratification of what disturbs her....But it won't be youu!!!!! GRRR!!!!!! She returned need and ulnerability with exploitation and entrapment. It looked like love, but it wasn't

YOu have also established a direction! and you are making peace with your present (very important!!!!!!) (Highlighted in red)

You are cultivating a Identity within you different from the one she manipulated. I have given my identities names so I can easily recognized them with my conscious mind.

When you are content with yourself, you will attract someone who is also content with herself. This will be the one that returns love with love.

[BrianB]

I'm also here for you. You can bend my ear here or in a private message. It was just frustrating to watch you go back to her for more abuse. Now you are making positive changes for your life. You are right that warm fuzzy feelings are not enough to build something lasting. It's nice to have them. They just won't sustain your relationship.

[pnggrad79]

I guess the last time she left, I turned a corner. I guess I went through all the grieving process this summer and realized I was beating my head against a brick wall with her. I am never going to win with her. She has these unrealistic expectations, expecting virtual perfection, when she so blithely makes mistakes and conveniently ignores them or explains them away. I just can't put myself back into that situation, when I really don't think she truly loves me. Not enough to accept me for who I am, human and all...

I am watching my mother go through the horrible disease of Alzheimer's and watching her waste away in front of me. That lying bitch told me she would be there for me during this time. Apparently all she told me was a bunch of lies.

I saw my father holding her hand and telling her he loved her and calling her sweetie and baby. I started crying thinking how I had so hoped I would die in her arms. Now I don't know that I won't die somewhere a lonely old lesbian who has lost everyone she ever loved.

[pnggrad79]

I swear sometimes, I really wish I had never met this bitch. Now she is ordering me to have all my things removed from the house by 7 AM on Monday or she will have them removed by a moving company. She can kiss my ass for all I care. My mom is literally within months if not weeks from death and she wants to add to my stress by doing this? All I can say is karma is a bitch!