Poll on Reconciling Faith and Sexuality

[Daniel]

A significant article on ex-gay therapies appears in today's NYTimes. Just so no one thinks that the Northeast is somehow immune to efforts by conservatives to change gay people to straight, you will find the name and locations of who is doing what here. There are plenty of organizatons and persons involved in religious oppression.

If you have the same discomforting feeling upon reading this article, you will not be alone. Articles written in the way this one is don't come off as sounding fair or balanced, even though they always mention that the scientific/theraputic community advise against efforts to change sexual orientation. Why?

What is missing in articles like this is the recognition that religious oppression is behind the ex-gay movement itself. No one wants to call it for what it is.

Ignoring religious oppression and hate has nothing to do with freedom of religion.

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/02/12/nyregion/12group.html

Some Tormented by Homosexuality Look to a Controversial Therapy

[shadeseraph]

Hi,

I am closer to number 4. It has taken me a long time to reconcile my spirituality with my faith. But I have crossed that milestone of grace some years ago. I do believe I was "chosen" to be gay and that being gay has brought me much grace. In the Resurrection there will only be love so I see no conflict in this life or the next.

I had to struggle for a while with being a "worthy" clergyman but now I see Jesus's face in that also. I think reconciliation only comes with prayer and bringing all parts of yourself to Jesus. Perhaps if I had been straight I would not know God so profoundly. Lately in my life I have decided to seek in spirit and pray for a loving soulmate to share my life in some way. I already have a person I have fallen in love with whom I share a very special relationship though it is not sexual. I feel perhaps I am to have this other I seek in my life. Anyway I am confident enough in God now to have no problem as a gay person asking God to send this person into my life as a grace.

Peace,
shadeseraph
________
Uggs

[Zerbie]

Oh god Daniel that article makes me so sad!!

It is just horrifying that people are taught to feel such shame in themselves they would actually pay that much money to a "therapist" to change them. I question anyone who would charge that much money to change someone's ability to love and be loved. I'm tempted to say, send their clients over to my house, we'll cook dinner and talk for a while, and it'll be free.

Really breaks my heart. And this article is timely, considering that Love Won Out was just here in my town the other day.

Really, these folks need to leave people alone to find their own way, and stop pressuring them to be straight, or to 'pass', or into a lifetime of celibacy when they would prefer to have a loving relationship.

[keltic63]

Originally Posted by davidcom

The saddest statement was that of Mr. Larsen saying that his same sex attraction was now "just a matter of noticing" What he is describing is just repression of himself. What he doesn't know is that the offspring of that represssion will be a generalized depression that may well threaten his life. How many years of his young life will be squandered in loneliness, guilt, self-loathing and depression before he discovers what was done to him and what he has done to himself.

I speak from experience!

it nearly killed me.

David, I'm glad you're here. I've read that we both had the same problem, and resolved it differently, but the important thing is that we acknowledge who we really are, and live happy healthy lives.

[BrianB]

Listening to Mel White along with many others has changed the way which I view the "clobber passages" of the bible. Most of those passages were for a specific time and for a specific group of people. They don't apply any more than the passage about stoning rebellious children.

Being in a loving committed relationship drew me closer to God, not farther away. It was a relationship where we met the other's needs first at least in the bedroom. Unfortunately we grew apart in other areas.

[Zerbie]

Thought maybe we'd bump this and maybe Innout might wander over here. . . .

[Gennee]

#1.
I discovered that I was transgendered and a crossdresser two years ago. When I admitted this to myself all the stress and tension disappeared. God never rejected me and he doesn't reject anyone who comes to him.

I feel happy and complete since that day. God loves LGBT people and that is something that I believe wholeheartedly.

Gennee

[mommy2jb3]

The rest are explained by the original poll.

What now?!? is the fact that the others all started coming together 2 months into marriage. I didn't feel safe enough to start acknowledging my emotions, the reasons for complicated friendships, etc. until AFTER I was married...

So, I engaged in the whole shaming, guilt, grieving thing due to that... but that's more than 8 years ago... and time has a way of bringing partial healing... now I'm ready for a little more

Thanks for the thought-provoking question!

[Blockwell]

I suppose #13 is the closest:

13. Divorce: Faith was unable to be reconciled or to adequately address my sexuality. Therefore I no longer consider myself a person of faith.

I grew up in a nominal Christian family. We attended a liberal neighborhood church (Reformed Church of America) until I was eight years old and then we stopped going. I think my parents just thought it was a good idea to take their kids to church. From what little I remember it felt more like a large social club for the neighborhood. My parents never practiced their faith and the only prayers I can recall were on Thanksgiving and Christmas and that was just for show.

One of the earliest memories I have took place in Sunday School when I was about six or seven years old. I remember the teacher was telling us a Bible story and I found it so unbelievable that I recall looking around the room for a camera. Why? Because I thought Alan Funt might just break through a door and scream “Smile, you’re on Candid Camera!” (I hope some of you are old enough to get the reference). It was program designed to embarrass gullible people on national television and I thought this must be a set up. What I am trying to get at is that I never really believed any of it. It was just too incredible for me to take seriously.

For those of you who have read other posts of mine you know that I joined the Mormon Church when I turned 16. After reading what I just wrote it would seem ridiculous for me to do such a thing, but fear and desperation make people do odd things. I wanted to be straight and I obviously needed help. I could not tell anyone about my problem so I searched out what I thought was an organization that could “repair” me without having to divulge my secret. The fact that our neighbor was Mormon and would drive me to church was probably the deciding factor in why I chose Mormonism. (Really) During my two year stay with the Mormons I did my best to believe. I looked for signs that God was working in my life and thought I found some. I trusted the testimony of others. Any unusual emotional response was relegated to the work of the Holy Spirit. I tried, I really tried to believe.

Eventually I had a breakdown on the way to church and could not stop crying. I knew it was not going to work. I was gay and that was all there was to it. This was 1978 and the gay movement was just getting some steam. For the first time I was able to read stories about gays and lesbians that were not negative. I read about men who led lives I could see myself emulating. I did not need to try and change anymore, I could be myself. I no longer needed anyone to fix me. The need for the church was gone. I reverted back to my old skeptical self and never looked back.

[antonyh]

I progressed through various stages.

Age 11-23

6. Exception: I am a faithful believer ... devout in everyway. My sexuality, while being unacceptable to God, is my one apparent weakness ... the thorn in my side.

Age 24-28

2. No Reconciliation: I have not reconciled my faith and my sexuality. It still provides great anxiety for me since i am a "practicing homo/bi-sexual".

Age 29-32

4. Interpretation: New Biblical insights into the context and content of various Biblical passages regarding sexuality helped me to understand that homosexuality is not against God's will and infact may be what God intended for my life.

Age 32+

7. Spirituality: The inner voice of my own spiritual practice has brought harmony to my faith and sexuality. I do not feel the need for "correct" Biblical interpretation.

Very insightful poll. I think it shows how long and steep the journey is for some of us.

[cousin.of.zuzu]

I'm somewhere between a 4 and a 10. I seem to go back and forth between the two and spend time in the 10 zone when thinking about telling my family...

[wmanion]

I am not sure where I am. I do know that I have accepted that I am gay and God has made me that way. So in that respect, I have reconcilled my self to God. However, I have not reconcilled myself to any belief systems of the faiths/religions that exist. Soulforce is the closest I have come to church in thirteen years. I am not even sure if Jesus intended for us to worship in houses of faith. He never said go out and build buildings to preach my word and have fellowship. From my understanding the church he was building was an invisible body, his bride, of believers from all walks of life. He never said stop worshipping in the temples, in fact, he had great respect for his father's house. However, the temples were for the Jewish people. I do miss the singing, the worship songs and many of the people. But I do not miss the codemnation, the judgement, and the oppression I felt for something I did not choose. Maybe I do fall in that chart somewhere, I am just not sure. Any thoughts?

Bill

[Zerbie]

Originally Posted by wmanion

I I am not even sure if Jesus intended for us to worship in houses of faith. He never said go out and build buildings to preach my word and have fellowship. From my understanding the church he was building was an invisible body, his bride, of believers from all walks of life. Bill

Yes, I believe so.

[Pablo Rafael]

Originally Posted by wmanion

I am not even sure if Jesus intended for us to worship in houses of faith. He never said go out and build buildings to preach my word and have fellowship. From my understanding the church he was building was an invisible body, his bride, of believers from all walks of life. l

Bill,

You make a very valid point. The "church" is the family of believers. It is not an organization or a building. Personally I am very much attached to the organized church. I love worshipping with others. I love the music, ceremony and fellowship. But also I see how much money and effort goes to keeping up buildings and supporting organizations. Sometimes I think the focus of the church strays away from the Gospel message and gets directed toward the church organization itself.

I do think it is important for people of faith to get together and strengthen each other and learn from each other. For some the organized church does not fit, but the "church" is still there among people of faith regardless of where they meet or who is included.

Tu Amigo, Pablo

[tdogg]

Originally Posted by Pablo Rafael

The "church" is the family of believers. It is not an organization or a building. Personally I am very much attached to the organized church. I love worshipping with others. I love the music, ceremony and fellowship. But also I see how much money and effort goes to keeping up buildings and supporting organizations. Sometimes I think the focus of the church strays away from the Gospel message and gets directed toward the church organization itself.

I do think it is important for people of faith to get together and strengthen each other and learn from each other. For some the organized church does not fit, but the "church" is still there among people of faith regardless of where they meet or who is included.

Well said Pablo! At least with the churches (in the formal organized sense of the word) I've experienced, it's all about the power, money, popularity, and what have you done for the church lately mentality. But when one is just hangin' with their brothers and sisters, it becomes about the church in the sense that Jesus spoke - the actual people united in faith and love.