Congressional Page Scandal

[Steven E. Webster]

Friends,
I wonder if one of the ironies here is that gay men like Fordham recognized that Mark Foley's fondness for very young men was bound to lead to trouble and they tried to warn Hastert's office. Now the gay GOP'ers will be blamed for Foley's actions.

I'm reminded of an incident in the Wisconsin Annual Conference of the United Methodist Church in which I was part of "blowing the whistle" on a Pastor who was molesting young, underage men. Two of his victims were friends of mine (though I never met or knew the Pastor in question himself). I know my two young friends were damaged by this man, and was happy to assist them in pressing their case to a successful resolution. My role was simply to introduce them to each other when I realized that they had both been victimized by the same Pastor.

I'm a little disappointed in Andrew Sullivan who keeps bringing up that the pages involved were 16 or older and therefore "legal" in D.C. My two friends would have been "legal" in D.C. (but not Wisconsin), and yet they were very much damaged by this man who held a position of power and trust.

Steven Webster

[Daniel]

Originally Posted by Steven E. Webster

Friends,
I wonder if one of the ironies here is that gay men like Fordham recognized that Mark Foley's fondness for very young men was bound to lead to trouble and they tried to warn Hastert's office. Now the gay GOP'ers will be blamed for Foley's actions.

Steven- you make a really good point! The matter is addressed- I really like this gal's take on the matter- thus:

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/hilary...i_b_31087.html

The right wing and its allies in Congress have never liked the wing of the Republican party that tolerated the gays. Now, that relationship is inconvenient for Denny Hastert, John Boehner and Tom Reynolds, all of whom are close to gay republican staffers. So they have adopted a new strategy. They support a whispering campaign to say that it is the staffer's fault that Foley was protected. That whispering campaign is the aggressive understory in this Foley scandal this week and the leadership is hoping that it saves their own hides. It won't work.

Mark Foley is a sick and troubled man whose life in the closet was only made more painful by his overwhelming need to be accepted by the Republican leadership. We were friends. I spent many hours (to no avail) with Foley over the years trying to encourage him to embrace his sexual orientation so he could stop worrying about being outed. I finally gave up after his behavior during his aborted Senate run. When a newspaper printed a story that he was gay, he acted as though he had been called a pedophile. Upon relfection, perhaps he knew where an examination of his life would lead and needed to stop it any way he could. At the time, I just assumed he was ashamed of being gay.

The Republican leadership did not protect him these last few months out of political correctness. They protected him because he was a lapdog for their agenda. Not only did he raise lots of money for them from his Palm Beach contacts, but to have the gay guy support their legislative agenda gave themsome sense of comfort that they weren't really discriminators or bigots.

Foley and his gay republican friends thought that they were accepted by their GOP friends. It is sadly ironic and unfortunate that legislative discrimination has not had the same painful impact on them that this week's whispering campaign has had. I have been frustrated over the years about the attitude that many gay republican staffers have had about working for members who vote against the LGBT community's interest, but I truly believe that it is their personal problem. They pay (or not as the case may be) their own internal price of anguish, ambivalence and shame. I have always , however, blamed Members of Congress, not their staffs, for how they voted.

It is time for the Republican leadership to acknowledge what the rest of the country already knows: they screwed up and in a surge of power abuse protected disgusting and immoral behavior. They, not the staffers around the edges, are accountable to the people and must take responsibility for their actions.

The back row of the choir- where the the tall boys sit- is yelling: "Preach it Sister!"

"Amen!"

[Giancarlo]

http://online.logcabin.org/news_view...log-cabin.html

"(Washington, DC) – Log Cabin Executive Vice President Patrick Sammon issued the following statement regarding Mark Foley:

"Mark Foley's shameful actions were reprehensible. He abused the power of his office, violated the trust of the voters, and exploited young people.

"There should be a thorough criminal investigation by appropriate law enforcement agencies. If Mark Foley broke the law, he should be prosecuted to the full extent of the law.

"Additionally, there should be a full investigation to see if Congressional leaders responded appropriately to Foley's behavior. This unfortunate and inappropriate situation shouldn't be unduly politicized.

"Preying on young people is shameful, immoral, unethical and illegal, regardless of sexual orientation.""

----


Well I used to be a log cabin republican believe it or not, but I trailed off to libertarianism. However, I am presently campaigning for Arnold Schwarzenegger in this state (passing out flyers at my campus). I feel like that both parties should be pushed back to the center, and with present circumstances this isn't going to happen.

[keltic63]

and now we hear from our friend, Pat Robertson: http://mediamatters.org/items/200610050009

[Jamie McDaniel]

Interesting article, if not sad about the "agreements" gay people sometimes make in exchange for a false acceptance.

Los Angeles Times: Path Is Risky for Gay GOP Politicians

[Daniel]

I know the writer of this article, Andy Humm, who, along with Ann Northrop, hosts the weekly show here in NYC- Gay Cable News. Andy also writes for Gay City News. His piece on Foley and company is interesting, especially:

http://www.gaycitynews.com/gcn_540/t...allofmark.html

If only Foley had spoken with his colleague Barney Frank (D-MA). The lesson of the Foley case, he said on a visit to New York last weekend, is “don't be closeted. I lived it myself. You cannot deny your physical and emotional needs.” He added that he was “way too cranky” when he was in the closet.

Frank was here to boost the National Stonewall Democrats and their campaign both to return the House to the Democrats and make members of the party more pro-gay, a prospect that seems infinitely more possible after the Foley Follies.

Or Foley could have listened to Doug Jennings, a 19-year old gay activist from Utah here in New York interning at gay groups. “It's a choice to be in the closet. If I can live in conservative southern Utah and be out since I was 14 and have a great high school and social and family experience and be OK, then Foley has no excuse and neither does Jim McGreevey.” Jennings added, “I've never had the emotional energy to be who I'm not.”

Never better said Mr. Jennings!

[Steven E. Webster]

Friends,
I'm a liberal Democrat at heart, but I love to read Andrew Sullivan. I disagree with him totally on the war in Iraq--it was wrong and I'm against it, but I agree with Andrew on a lot of other things. I first became a fan of Andrew's when I read his book "Virtually Normal."

Anyway, hear's a link or two to some interesting things he's been saying on the Foley matter:

http://time.blogs.com/daily_dish/200...ley_point.html

http://time.blogs.com/daily_dish/200..._and_fole.html

[kara speltz]

I highly recommend reading this article that appeared in the San Francisco Chronicle.

http://sfgate.com/cgi-bin/article.cg...NG9HLKTVH1.DTL

kara

[BruceChris]

I would like to point out to you that most homosexuals are not nearly as obsessed with sex as are those people who are obsessed with homosexuals.

Peace and Love, Bruce Chris

[Giancarlo]

Originally Posted by BruceChris

I would like to point out to you that most homosexuals are not nearly as obsessed with sex as are those people who are obsessed with homosexuals.

Peace and Love, Bruce Chris

That's perhaps the finest point I have heard on this forum. It is funny that christian conservatives spend most of their time talking about how evil sex is...they think about it more than anyone else.

[Daniel]

The hay that is being made regarding gay persons in the Foley scandal (that being gay equals pedophilia) by fundamentalists ignores the facts. Here they are in black and white. The truth really does set us free from the lies being told by those who mean to condemn us in ignorance and fear.

http://www.gaycitynews.com/gcn_540/f...ndmirrors.html

Here’s the truth. In 1994, a study by Dr. Carole Jenny of the University of Colorado Health Sciences Center appeared in Pediatrics, a peer-reviewed journal. The subjects were 269 sexually abused children seen at Denver Children’s Hospital over one year. Heterosexuals molested more than 99 percent of the girls in the study. Of that number, heterosexual males who knew their victims molested 80 percent. Heterosexuals molested 98 percent of the boys in the study. Of that number, heterosexual males who knew their victims molested 75 percent. Got it? Gays aren’t the problem, pedophiles are, no matter what the Catholic Church or the Republican leadership say.

Now it is our turn. Every gay person has the obligation to make this critical distinction clear. Even more importantly, every friend and family member of a gay person now has the obligation to stand up for us. Go tell it on the mountain. Being gay is ok, being a criminal and preying on children is not.

[Emproph]

Jim Burroway over at BoxTurtleBulletin did an excellent breakdown of Perkins' recent homosexuality=pedophilia claims.

[Steven E. Webster]

Friends,

Daily Kos takes note of some public statements from Tony Perkins of Dobson's Family Research Council. It seems that Tony Perkins has been in on the "secret" that Foley was chasing after congressional pages. He's no more pure than Hastert is.

http://www.dailykos.com/story/2006/10/7/21832/0030

Steven Webster

[Daniel]

A friend of Bill- as least if I remember that correctly- makes an interesting point on Hufftingpost.com

And yet when I watch the liberal punsters on television, I can't help suspecting that they're taking advantage of the homophobia in the culture in order to make slightly more of this episode than it may in fact turn out to be worth. When I watch the Democratic politicians smack their lips, I can't help wondering whether they've forgotten that this is the sort of scandal that can happen to either party, and there's no evidence that Democrats would have handled it any better. In short, I can't help thinking that the homophobia is catching.

I've been wondering this myself.

If this was ancient Rome (please don't throw rocks at me for saying this) mothers would be shoving their sons at Mr. Foley. We may think ourselves superior, but then, I think those old Romans knew what we have forgotten under our cloak of moral righteous: its not about sex, it's about power.

[revtj]

I agree, the Republican right-wing christians are like the munchkins dancing just before the big poof when the wicked witch of the west shows up, only the witch will be one of their own (like Ralph Reed, etc.)

OH and did the editorial by Laura Douglas-Brown show up in any of the other national papers besides Southern Voice? Here is a link to the editorial:

http://www.sovo.com/2006/10-6/view/editorial/blame.cfm

And here is my response, written under a pen-name.


Editor:

Laura Douglas-Brown lacks empathy as well as
information about the long, checkered historical gay
male struggle for self-acceptance, and the definition
of pedophilia, as evidenced by her recent editorial,
'Don’t Blame the Closet' in which she blames HRC and
NGLTF groups for rallying around McGreevey but not
Foley. She says neither gentleman, nor any of the rest
of us, are allowed to blame the closet for their bad
behavior. To have it her way, gays would've abandoned
both of them. Makes me wonder, how long did you ever
spend in the gay male closet, Ms. Douglas-Brown?

Have you ever been blackmailed over your sexual
orientation? It appears you do not to have any idea
what that generation of gay men experienced as
normal to keep their jobs and their reputations.

You mention nothing of the right wing christian
groups, who immediately defended the Republicans for
hiding numerous reports of Foley’s pathetic online
life, saying they were only trying to be politically
correct and avoid homophobia. You mention nothing of
the numerous pundits and politicians who have actually
had the chutzpah to blame the scandal on the
Democrats. (Fox News actually identified Foley as a
Democrat in one segment! He is a Republican.)

More importantly, you neglected to mention that
pedophilia is a crime, different from adult consensual
homosexuality, and that both HRC and NGLTF are on
record agreeing that it is a crime. This is why they
distanced themselves from Foley but not McGreevey.
Your failure to understand this is inexcusable.

But true to form, SoVo says it’s HRC’s fault, or any
organization that is fighting for our rights. Why is
that the usual formula for a SoVo editorial? If we
ourselves are always to blame for every failure, every
defeat, every public figure sadly distorted and out of
bounds under the yoke of compulsory homophobia, then
what exactly do you suggest LGBT people do? Thrive on
SoVo’s endless cycle of communal demonizing and
blaming the victim? It seems more than a bit ignorant
and cruel to oppose our own progress no matter how
messy it gets.

Gay communities, independent & progressive voters are
beginning to catch on that not every legal loss, nor
every inconsistency in the gay community, can be
traced back to HRC, the NGLTF, the Democrats or the
imaginary ‘gay left.’ The closet is full of demons and
monsters and blaming the victim is the Hydra of them
all. We have the right to expect better from a
so-called gay newspaper.

Sincerely,
Aloof J.S. Swift
Atlanta, GA

[NathanATX]

blog.myspace.com/nathanatx

The Religous Right Created Ex-Congressman Foley

If you have been camping in Kansas for the past few weeks and haven't kept up with the news, I'll fill you in...

Mark Foley is a REPUBLICAN U.S. Congressman who recently resigned after being confronted by ABC News about his emails & instant messages to underage male congressional pages.

He's recently admitted being gay and to being an alcholic. The news media and all the pundits are focusing on two things:

1. The despicable act of a grown man, an elected official, preying on teenage boys.

2. The lengths the Republican party went to in order to keep Foley's "indiscretions" a secret.

I think both of these things are worthy of the time and energy being devoted to them, but I think there is something else that is being missed.

The immediate conclusion of most people, myself included, was that he was simply a predator. But today, as I was reading the news that several more boys came forward about Foley's advances towards them, something else occurred to me.

Foley is exhibiting the behavior of a teenager because that is where he is at--in terms of normal socialization or dating skills. Being a closeted gay man and not getting to experience a normal, healthy dating process as a young man, he is now acting out on his sexual urges in a very immature and irresponsible way.

What on earth would cause a gifted, smart, attractive man to be so socially immature?

And everyone's eyes should be turning to look at the self-righteous, bigoted fundamentalist sitting in the corner... pulling the strings of the Republican party.



Meet Mrs. Betty Bowers, "America's Best Christian." In her words... "You see," says Betty with patience that never betrays her annoyance at her Savior for postponing the Second Coming - again, "Baptists hate anyone who does not take the time to be exactly like us --- not because we are afraid of missing out on the fun --- no, no, no, but because we love you enough to fix the Lord's careless errors and re-create you to conform to our, more exacting, specifications." This is why Betty started her ex-gay ministry BASH: Baptists Are Saving Homosexuals. "Although the so-called former-fairies always --- I mean, good gracious me, always --- lapse. Baptists still try to use the sweet love of Jesus to BASH them every chance we get. As long as we can convince everyone that being a homo is just a silly choice --- like picking a vulgar tie after one too many Manhattans --- then we can successfully marginalize fruits as humans." (from http://www.bettybowers.com/baptists/betty.html)

Of course, Betty Bowers is just a spoof character representing fundamentalists. Take out the satire, though, and what do you have? A twisted and manipulative theology that mandates control and conformity. It expels, condemns and excommunicates anyone who doesn't conform.

Because the Republican party sold it's soul to the likes of James Dobson and Jerry Falwell years back in their quest for power, they have themselves become the puppets of fundamentalism.

Now we have Mark Foley, who in anyone's eyes (before this happened) would be a dream husband, going around taking advantage of young immature teenage boys because he didn't have the chutzpah to come out when he was a kid and deal with dating & sex issues the way other kids do.

Do we blame him for not being responsible for coming out and dealing with his sexuality?

Do we blame fundamentalism for terrifying glbt kids into hiding who they are, limiting their normal development... causing them to grow up and make irresponsible & immature choices that harm themselves and others?

Yes, Mark Foley messed up big time.

What about all the thousands of young people who grew up in similar environments that cause similar issues in their lives? How many gay men who have died of AIDS might have valued their lives and taken care of themselves if they had been given a chance to grow up with an equal opportunity to love themselves and discover what it means to "be" them? How many people continually put themselves at risk through substance abuse, unsafe sex, violent relationships because they don't truly love themselves?

Where does the blame for all this really lie?

Take another look at fundamentalism, my friends. If you have been hurt by it, you need to know there is another way to believe. If you are caught up in it, you need to know the damage it causes.

[revtj]

Excellent post.

Think how Foley could've served his nation had it been OK to come out 25 years ago!? It would redeem nearly every piece of legislation not to mention Foley himself.

The church may have the keys to the reign of God, bit the fundamentalists have the keys to the closet. And it's damned time we snatch them out of their hands, unlock the door, and free ourselves from the deformed personalities, distorted, compartmentalized lunacy it creates in our community.

I feel very sorry for Foley but I suspect his fate is sealed.

[NathanATX]

Mr. Foley,

I just wanted you to know that people are praying for you. We are concerned about you.

Yes, you have made some mistakes. It's now time to dust yourself off and recommit to being the man you know you are.

In the Bible, Paul talked about "being in the race" where the goal was to be like Jesus. And he acknowledged that he messed up a lot. But he said, "this is what I do. I get back up and I get back in the race."

Mr. Foley, know that your mistakes do not define you, but your response to the mistakes does.

I pray that you will be surrounded with the protection & peace of God during this time in your life. I pray that you will see yourself the way God does and that you will forgive yourself.

From one gay man to another, let me tell you loud and clear that you can be gay and live a life of integrity. You can be gay and be a person of faith, of leadership and power.

I'm praying for you, Mr. Foley.

Sincerely,
Nate Black
www.nateblack.us

Friends of Mark Foley
P.O. Box 30505
Palm Beach Gardens, FL 33420

Phone: 561-688-0717
FAX: 561-688-5858

[pnggrad79]

While Mr. Foley may have propositioned underage boys for sexual favors, it only highlights the fact that:

1. Because homosexuality is such a taboo in America, one may feel he/she has to go "underage" because they know if they went after adults, it would be called sexual harassment. Not that it makes it ok, but it might explain his actions. Still very wrong!

2. As a lesbian, I was accused by my own sisters, of being a sexual deviant and was not allowed near my nephews, as if "gayness" is catching! Please. I am not a pedophile and would never even think like that.

To be painted as a pedophile and have it linked to homosexuality is just grandstanding on the part of the fundamentalists because they know they are losing this fight. Hitler did the same thing with the Jews, painting them as killers of Christ. Stand firm, we will win this fight. Foley has his own problems and we need to pray for him, but this isn't about his homosexuality. It is about his integrity as an elected official.

[NathanATX]

My issue isn't with the age of the boys because they were all over the age of consent. (Am I personally uncomfortable with a 40+ year old man hitting on teenagers...? Yes. But that's my issue.)

My issue with Foley is that what he did amounted to an abuse of his power as a supervisor/employer. Not only were these guys young, but their employment/internship was potentially under the influence of Mr. Foley. He could coerce them with threats of losing their jobs or seduce them with promises of promotions or other jobs. It's out of line and probably a textbook definition of sexual harassment.