Ex-gays Stated Reasons to turn Straight

[Huggins293]

Please read below the reasons ex-gays give to turn straight. Have you ever encountered reasons such as this? Please comment about any statement and give your input:

I realized I was looking for a father figure that my dad was not.”“I want to overcome the wounds thrown on me via sexual abuse by other males who used me.”

“My homosexual desires seem to be rooted in a deficit that I feel and want another man to fill. [In contrast,] my heterosexual desires come from a sense of being complemented by the attributes of a woman.”

“I see it as a false and unsatisfactory way to cater to basic emotional needs that were not properly met in my childhood and adolescence.”

“These feelings always contradicted with my moral values. They’ve caused me much pain when they’ve come up within my male friendships.”

“I truly believe I can never be happy in a gay life and I’m positive that change is possible. This motivates me to seek change.”“

I have a strong relationship with God and anything that comes between that I don’t want in my life. This has been a huge obstacle in my relationship with God. I want to live the life God has for me, not the one I feel is easiest at times.”

“I am seeking a better relationship with God by giving up SSA for God’s will.”

I have my views that i will share later, but please offer comments on any of these views.

thanks Huggs

[1engelbythesea]

People have for centuries sublimated feelings. It is possible to self brain wash
and it requires constant reinforcement... But just as the mind is powerful the flesh is weak.
It may work for a while, but as soon as they think they are cured and stop the constant reinforcement their nature will return stronger than ever. Whether or not they act on it depends on how insecure or intimidated they are. Ted Haggart is an example, that is just my two cents.

[Giancarlo]

I bet they say those things before they hit up the local gay bar. Many of these "ex-gays" are caught there and often are caught with secret boyfriends.

[Huggins293]

Originally Posted by Giancarlo

I bet they say those things before they hit up the local gay bar. Many of these "ex-gays" are caught there and often are caught with secret boyfriends.

I have heard this before, but what I am still trying to find it is how do the justify homosexuality being immoral.

[Huggins293]

Originally Posted by 1engelbythesea

People have for centuries sublimated feelings. It is possible to self brain wash
and it requires constant reinforcement... But just as the mind is powerful the flesh is weak.
It may work for a while, but as soon as they think they are cured and stop the constant reinforcement their nature will return stronger than ever. Whether or not they act on it depends on how insecure or intimidated they are. Ted Haggart is an example, that is just my two cents.

What does this quote mean:

My homosexual desires seem to be rooted in a deficit that I feel and want another man to fill. [In contrast,] my heterosexual desires come from a sense of being complemented by the attributes of a woman.”

Has this dude been brainwashed so badly that he thinks complimitary attibrutes of a woman is an absolute superior optionl. Look how many times complimentary attributes in the hetero world lead to divorce. I am str8 guy and not into gay sexuality but the logic of heterosexuality in theory is baffling.

[Giancarlo]

Originally Posted by Huggins293

I have heard this before, but what I am still trying to find it is how do the justify homosexuality being immoral.

Man sometimes I get so mad about hearing people trying to justify it as immoral and then bringing in their perspective of the bible. I hear it so many times. Just today, this religious preacher was telling me all this hateful stuff because I had a rainbow bracelet (while I was minding my own business at a bus stop). I'm tired of these people.

[Huggins293]

Originally Posted by Giancarlo

Man sometimes I get so mad about hearing people trying to justify it as immoral and then bringing in their perspective of the bible. I hear it so many times. Just today, this religious preacher was telling me all this hateful stuff because I had a rainbow bracelet (while I was minding my own business at a bus stop). I'm tired of these people.

I do get frustrated at their message as well dude. Believe me I do. But I do want to caution you about describing those who oppose homosexual behavior as people who hate homosexuals rather than homosexual behavior. It is still a misguided belief but homosexual opponents are known to be at least friendly and respectful to homosexuals. I know associates at my place of work who dislike homosexuality but respect and care about homosexuals.

This does not negate the fact that their anti-homosexual views are still based on bigotry and ignorance.

I also like to add that many of my peers and friends support many tenents of the heterosexist ideology.

[Giancarlo]

Originally Posted by Huggins293

I do get frustrated at their message as well dude. Believe me I do. But I do want to caution you about describing those who oppose homosexual behavior as people who hate homosexuals rather than homosexual behavior. It is still a misguided belief but homosexual opponents are known to be at least friendly and respectful to homosexuals. I know associates at my place of work who dislike homosexuality but respect and care about homosexuals.

This does not negate the fact that their anti-homosexual views are still based on bigotry and ignorance.

I also like to add that many of my peers and friends support many tenents of the heterosexist ideology.

Those who oppose homosexual behavior and get in my face about it, are questioning my very existence. In other words, this guy was not friendly or respectful at all, and started telling me I was going to go to hell. For one thing, the people I speak of are the Fred Phelps types. I should of been more specific.

I also find it extremely difficult to find one who dislikes homosexuality, but respects homosexuals. Homosexuality is part of who I am, and if they don't like it... then they don't like me. Being a bigot does not change the fact they are hurting the person they direct the bigotry towards. Even if they are nice about it, telling a LGBT person they should change in 'respectful' terms... well this causes emotional hurt.

In other words, no matter how much they want to sugarcoat it, what they do is neither nice or respectful. The only nice and respectful position to take is to "live and let live".

Listen, I do understand what you're saying, but I can't say I agree.

[Huggins293]

Originally Posted by Giancarlo

Those who oppose homosexual behavior and get in my face about it, are questioning my very existence. In other words, this guy was not friendly or respectful at all, and started telling me I was going to go to hell. For one thing, the people I speak of are the Fred Phelps types. I should of been more specific.

He is very likely to border on hate or virtually hate. He is a vulgar heterosexist redneck.

I also find it extremely difficult to find one who dislikes homosexuality, but respects homosexuals. Homosexuality is part of who I am, and if they don't like it... then they don't like me. Being a bigot does not change the fact they are hurting the person they direct the bigotry towards.

I agree people who care about another group use hurtful means even thought it is not their intention to hurt. I agree that disliking homsexuality is virutally disrespecting homosexuality.

Even if they are nice about it, telling a LGBT person they should change in 'respectful' terms... well this causes emotional hurt.

This is especially devasting to a child, if it is their parent. I hate to say it but in that context I would not want to be gay and carry that burden. Although it is the moral equivalent of heterosexuality, I do not and would not have the courage to come out if I were gay.


I

[Giancarlo]

Originally Posted by Huggins293

I agree people who care about another group use hurtful means even thought it is not their intention to hurt. I agree that disliking homsexuality is virutally disrespecting homosexuality.

So you think that the statement "while I like black people, I do not agree with their blackness". While this statement is ridiculous and totally incorrect, your logic is the same. It isn't about caring. Those who dislike homosexuality are ones who want to see us, gays and lesbians, suffer. Disliking homosexuality is disrespect to a person and is a form of abuse.

This is especially devasting to a child, if it is their parent. I hate to say it but in that context I would not want to be gay and carry that burden. Although it is the moral equivalent of heterosexuality, I do not and would not have the courage to come out if I were gay.


I

I am gay, and I know what it takes to live in this society. I just don't see your point at all. I cannot give credibility to the anti-gay people in this world. And I will not admit they have anything but pure hate in their hearts.

[kara speltz]

Originally Posted by Giancarlo

I am gay, and I know what it takes to live in this society. I just don't see your point at all. I cannot give credibility to the anti-gay people in this world. And I will not admit they have anything but pure hate in their hearts.

Dear Giancarlo: Again you seem to make everything so black and white, when most of it is varying shades of grey. I have had amazing dialogue with straight Christians (and even an exgay Christian) where it was clear to me that there was NO HATRED on their part. The vast majority of people have good hearts and really believe that they are trying to save our souls. It's a mistaken belief on their part, but there is no evil about us in their hearts.

I can't help but wonder why you are attracted to this series of forums when the basic principle is that all of us our children of God; all of us fall short of the mark, and judgment is not our role on this planet.

I attend a parish that is very gay friendly. But that doesn't mean that they have much perception about what heterosexual privelege is. So that's part of my work at my parish; helping people comprehend what heterosexual privelege is; what class privelege is and what white skin privelege is all about. The vast majority of my congregation would never intentionally hurt anyone, but they some times do by their ignorance. Just as I sometime hurt people with my ignorance. Ultimately, it's about overcoming ignorance. There is a huge difference between ignorance and hatred. True much hatred comes out of fear and ignorance, but they are not necessarily inseparatable.

Do you like to play devil's advocate? Is that why your phrase things in the way you do? So many of your postings seem to be provocative, I just wonder why.

Kara

[Giancarlo]

Originally Posted by kara speltz

Dear Giancarlo: Again you seem to make everything so black and white, when most of it is varying shades of grey. I have had amazing dialogue with straight Christians (and even an exgay Christian) where it was clear to me that there was NO HATRED on their part. The vast majority of people have good hearts and really believe that they are trying to save our souls. It's a mistaken belief on their part, but there is no evil about us in their hearts.

I'm not putting this in black and white terms. I can see the varying shades of gray. However in this matter, anti-gay behavior is anti-gay behavior. It is hurtful and dangerous. There is no such thing as an "ex-gay" person, by the way. There is plenty of hatred in those who feel against gay people. I am not talking about christians who embrace homosexuals as human beings.

I can't help but wonder why you are attracted to this series of forums when the basic principle is that all of us our children of God; all of us fall short of the mark, and judgment is not our role on this planet.

I am wondering why you think this forum should exclude those who do not hold the same beliefs as you. I am agnostic/weak atheist. And doesn't it say "POLITICAL OPPRESSION" in the title?

I
Do you like to play devil's advocate? Is that why your phrase things in the way you do? So many of your postings seem to be provocative, I just wonder why.

Kara

My postings are not provocative. They are what I believe. I'm not playing devil's advocate. This is why I what I believe. I know for a fact there is no such thing as an "ex-gay" person, and I know for a fact that anti-gay behavior is hateful. There is no other way around it.

[Lydia]

This may be something that you've already thought of, Huggins, but one of the things that stuck out to me is that somel of those reasons (i.e. looking for a father figure, using relationships to fill in the cracks of one's emotional health) don't have anything to do with anyone's orientation.

They're due to other things: past trauma or abuse that hasn't been dealt with yet, poor interpersonal boundaries, a weak sense of self, and for some possibly an undiagnosed mental illness.

Apples and oranges were meant for fruit salads, not comparisons.

[Beth K. Eyres]

Most of those reasons sound really canned. I think I've read some of them on Focus on the Family's website (or their kin website "Troubledwith"). Don't some of them sound really Freudian? But people will always seek reasons and try to find meaning. Maybe these reasons to try to go straight make sense in their heads and seem truth.
Then there are the two that suggest God and gay are incompatible. And that is a message out there in the world.
As for encountering any of these reasons personally, nope, don't know any ex-gays.

[Huggins293]

Originally Posted by Lydia

This may be something that you've already thought of, Huggins, but one of the things that stuck out to me is that somel of those reasons (i.e. looking for a father figure, using relationships to fill in the cracks of one's emotional health) don't have anything to do with anyone's orientation.

They're due to other things: past trauma or abuse that hasn't been dealt with yet, poor interpersonal boundaries, a weak sense of self, and for some possibly an undiagnosed mental illness.

Apples and oranges were meant for fruit salads, not comparisons.

Good Point.

[Huggins293]

Originally Posted by kara speltz

Dear Giancarlo: Again you seem to make everything so black and white, when most of it is varying shades of grey. I have had amazing dialogue with straight Christians (and even an exgay Christian) where it was clear to me that there was NO HATRED on their part. The vast majority of people have good hearts and really believe that they are trying to save our souls. It's a mistaken belief on their part, but there is no evil about us in their hearts.

I can't help but wonder why you are attracted to this series of forums when the basic principle is that all of us our children of God; all of us fall short of the mark, and judgment is not our role on this planet.

I attend a parish that is very gay friendly. But that doesn't mean that they have much perception about what heterosexual privelege is. So that's part of my work at my parish; helping people comprehend what heterosexual privelege is; what class privelege is and what white skin privelege is all about. The vast majority of my congregation would never intentionally hurt anyone, but they some times do by their ignorance. Just as I sometime hurt people with my ignorance. Ultimately, it's about overcoming ignorance. There is a huge difference between ignorance and hatred. True much hatred comes out of fear and ignorance, but they are not necessarily inseparatable.

Kara

Kara you said what I felt perfectly. As activists we can not paint all anti-gays as haters of homosexuals as persons. It would be inaccurate and it prevents anti-gays who actually love gays, from understanding their bigotryand ignorance. Simply because we assert anti-gays are loving doesn't mean how they love is not influenced by ignorance and bigotry.

[Giancarlo]

Originally Posted by Huggins293

Kara you said what I felt perfectly. As activists we can not paint all anti-gays as haters of homosexuals as persons. It would be inaccurate and it prevents anti-gays who actually love gays, from understanding their bigotryand ignorance. Simply because we assert anti-gays are loving doesn't mean how they love is not influenced by ignorance and bigotry.

How are they not haters? How do they love us? Please. They are bigoted and arrogant. I'm starting to see an agenda here to sugarcoat the anti-gay beliefs.

[kara speltz]

Originally Posted by Giancarlo

How are they not haters? How do they love us? Please. They are bigoted and arrogant. I'm starting to see an agenda here to sugarcoat the anti-gay beliefs.

Oh for God's sakes, Giancarlo chill out! This website is committed to trying to follow the principles of nonviolence if that offends you then find another place to post. That's why I asked you what draws you to this forum, given that our basic understanding is that people are not our enemies, only ignorance is.

And if anyone is arrogant......

kara

[Giancarlo]

Originally Posted by kara speltz

Oh for God's sakes, Giancarlo chill out! This website is committed to trying to follow the principles of nonviolence if that offends you then find another place to post. That's why I asked you what draws you to this forum, given that our basic understanding is that people are not our enemies, only ignorance is.

And if anyone is arrogant......

kara

I'm not a violent person. That simple. I am not trying to make enemies. I'm just speaking my mind. I'm not arrogant. I don't think it's right to accuse me of being violent.

[kara speltz]

Originally Posted by Huggins293

Kara you said what I felt perfectly. As activists we can not paint all anti-gays as haters of homosexuals as persons. It would be inaccurate and it prevents anti-gays who actually love gays, from understanding their bigotryand ignorance. Simply because we assert anti-gays are loving doesn't mean how they love is not influenced by ignorance and bigotry.

Dear Huggins: You have said it clearly and precisely. I know at times as a member of an oppressed minority, I tend to expect people at times to have an agenda that is to deny me my rights. When the truth is they simply have no comprehension of what it means to live in a society that grants priveleges to class, race, money and heterosexuals.

A couple of weeks ago I gave a workshop at the National Catholic Worker gathering. The title of the workshop was, "Heterosexual Privelege and the Catholic Worker Movement." When the monthly newspaper came out from the host community, I expected they would probably not say much about my workshop, because of a history of ignoring our issues.

Much to my surprise, one of the main articles featured the workshop and more importantly used "heterosexual privelege," in the title of the article. So my assumptions were all wrong.

Clearly folks within the Catholic Worker are trying to add heterosexism to their understanding of privelege in our society. That made me really happy.

Kara