Gay Marriage? Polygamy? In Germany, it's Incest

[BruceChris]

http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/europe/6424937.stm Let's give the A.F.A something useful to do, for a change!

Not really sure how I feel here, Bruce Chris

[J.D.]

Is this that strange?

Incest is illegal for the reason that it has been proven to cause the deterioration of the human genetical structure.

In earlier centuries when Kings still ruled, families struggled to keep the scepter within their grasp. To accomplish this, they intermarried within their own family, thereby continually holding the bloodline together.

Unfortunately they didn't realize the medical disaster they were unknowingly bringing upon themselves. After a few generations, family members began to die of bleeding disorders. Historians have connected the bleeding to the incest of previous generations. Since then it has been seen as a crude and destructive practice.

So in this case, this couple is looking past the dangers of bringing their children into the world with greater posisbility of dangers and even death. That is why it is against the law.

-JD

[u-dog]

JD,

I don't think any of us here will take up the challenge of defending incest. BruceChris is referencing another discussion of the fact that the African Anglican churches oppose equality for gay people yet have no problem making accomodation with polygamists. There is, as far as I know, no incest lobby to be found on the Soulforce forum.

[BruceChris]

Thanks, u-dog -- BC

[WillySF]

I wonder really, how much of an issue is incest? I mean the numbers must be miniscule. As far as these people are concerned, although they are biological siblings, they did not grow up together. It's pretty weird, but there's plenty of weirdness in the world come to think of it.

Even though I find myself repulsed by such an idea, these people seem to love each other. The libertarian in me is distressed by the thought of the state taking away their children and puting these people in jail. I wonder what that accomplishes? While marriage within the immediate family is not a good idea, and hardly necessary for the survival of the species – I doubt the children are likely to suffer beacuse of it in this case.

I guess I just do not see this as a pressing issue. If the state were not to outlaw such acts, would brothers and sisters rush to get married? I doubt that very much. I think these poor people should be left alone, providing the children are not being abused – and there's no indication of that.

[u-dog]

Geoff,

While situations like this one may be rare (biological siblings meeting as adults and falling in love, marrying and having children ) incest itself is FRIGHTENINGLY common. Mother/son, father/daughter, father/son, mother/daughter, older/younger sibling incest is commonplace and the emotional fallout is devastating. The road to recovery is long and convoluted. the taboos against incest exist in almost every culture and predate any understanding of the genetic dangers involved. Perhaps there is a reason for this? Some pandora's boxes don't need to be opened. I'm sorry for the suffering of these particular people, but sometimes it can't be helped.

[BruceChris]

I was trying to raise the question as to why some kinds of intimate relationships are encouraged, why some are discouraged, and why the discussion is usually carried out entirely on an emotional/traditional basis, and so rarely as a matter of more reasoned discourse.

I am personally opposed to polygamy and incest, and I am also of course aware that most intimate relationships of any kind fail.

I did hear a rumour that Cleopatra was the offspring of 27 generations of brother-sister royal marriages. Does anyone have any data on that?

P&L, BC

[WillySF]

I must confess woeful ignorance. I had no idea this was so prevalent. I still do not understand in this particular case, how prosecution and dividing an existing family can be deemed effective in addressing the issue however. Individual liberty versus the state, I guess. In a case where the community is not adversely affected, I tend to side with my libertarian tendencies.

[BruceChris]

Suppose that a brother and sister, (their past need not concern us here), were to get married. The man turned out to be infertile, and so artificial insemnation was used, to raise a family.

------------------------------------ Thoughts?---------------------------

Peace and Love, Bruce Chris

[WillySF]

Does the state need to meddle in the affairs of consenting adults?

The issue is not one of personal morality in my mind. Obviously in the case of sexual abuse or misuse of children, then I think the state must intervene.