Equality Ride visit to Palm Beach Atlantic

[MCstudent]

The Riders are at Palm Beach Atlantic University today, and have been told they would not be allowed on campus. I haven't heard anything today how things are, but keep them in your thoughts/prayers, they need it.

[scott snedeker]

Originally Posted by MCstudent

The Riders are at Palm Beach Atlantic University today, and have been told they would not be allowed on campus. I haven't heard anything today how things are, but keep them in your thoughts/prayers, they need it.

I admire the courage of those who are facing the trials today.

Good wishes go to them!

[Godsgift126]

In my opinion soulforce lost a lot of repect from me from their immature actions, im all for the rights, and the cause and the purpose, but i heard straight up lies told to some of the more naive students of Palm Beach Atlantic. And i personally talked to the girl after she "came out" and she sad none of things about feeling feeling unsafe, insecure, and threatened on campus. I just wish soulforce woulde stuck to the motives they came here to accomplish instead of being just like "every other" activist group. I thought they were different, i was much disappointed...

[Jamie McDaniel]

Originally Posted by Godsgift126

In my opinion soulforce lost a lot of repect from me from their immature actions, im all for the rights, and the cause and the purpose, but i heard straight up lies told to some of the more naive students of Palm Beach Atlantic. And i personally talked to the girl after she "came out" and she sad none of things about feeling feeling unsafe, insecure, and threatened on campus. I just wish soulforce woulde stuck to the motives they came here to accomplish instead of being just like "every other" activist group. I thought they were different, i was much disappointed...

Godsgift126, I'm glad you came here to talk with some of the people of Soulforce who are not on the bus, but I have a couple of questions. Since you were there, I would like for you to list what exactly you felt were "immature actions." That would help with any discussion.

I must say that it has been my experience over the years that a good number of people who are wrestling with their understanding of LGBT people seem to suddenly have problems whenever we "push" or are otherwise assertive. I've heard the phrase "lose my respect" or "lose my support" or "no longer donating" before whenever we are perceived as having moved from "asking" to "demanding."

But push an oppressed people must, because, friend, equality doesn't just happen. Oppression is never threatened by people of good-will merely asking for justice. I'm sure your study of the civil rights movement of the 50's and 60's led you to this conclusion with regard to the African American struggle for freedom. Similarly for women gaining the right to vote. Now, in our time, equality for gay, lesbian, bisexual, and transgender people.

Also your statement "like every other activist group" makes me wonder what brought you to have such a low view of activists. Given the life of Jesus and his social-justice ways, you'll have to explain that one to me.

Looking forward to hearing from you.

Added: six of the riders are in jail overnight in Florida. Please keep them in your thoughts. I've only been in a holding cell for four hours - just long enough to start worrying about having to go to the bathroom. An overnight stay could be no fun.

[Daniel]

Originally Posted by Godsgift126

... but i heard straight up lies told to some of the more naive students of Palm Beach Atlantic.

...and painting with such a broad brush...

It would help if you related exactly what was discussed and what you considered to be a lie(s).

Looking forward to your post.

And welcome to the forum.

[Rick336]

Originally Posted by Jamie McDaniel

Added: six of the riders are in jail overnight in Florida. Please keep them in your thoughts. I've only been in a holding cell for four hours - just long enough to start worrying about having to go to the bathroom. An overnight stay could be no fun.

You guys in jail are heroes of the movement. You are warriors on the front line of equality and justice. Thank you for your courage.


"An individual who breaks a law that conscience tells him is unjust, and who willingly accepts the penalty of imprisonment in order to arouse the conscience of the community over its injustice, is in reality expressing the highest respect for the law." - Martin Luther King


Rick

[fiercest]

Originally Posted by Godsgift126

In my opinion soulforce lost a lot of repect from me from their immature actions, im all for the rights, and the cause and the purpose, but i heard straight up lies told to some of the more naive students of Palm Beach Atlantic. And i personally talked to the girl after she "came out" and she sad none of things about feeling feeling unsafe, insecure, and threatened on campus. I just wish soulforce woulde stuck to the motives they came here to accomplish instead of being just like "every other" activist group. I thought they were different, i was much disappointed...

Thanks for sharing your view, I'm glad that you feel that this forum is a safe enough space to do so. Now if only PBA students had the chance to feel such freedom........

We had a productive day, but we are missing the members of our team who are in jail for the night. As I lay in my comfy bed, my heart is aching for them. Thanks for all of your thoughts and prayers. Feel free to email them individually.

[Godsgift126]

i didnt mean to cause a stir at all, and i hope i address all the ?'s that were asked of me...
when i said immature actions i meant the whole getting arrested thing. Don't get me wrong ive been arrested for a similiar type of sit in, for different purposes, but none the less have been there and done that. but the facts are and were admitted by a soul force member, that they had previously called the county to find out how much bail was for one person, knowing how many bodies they feel that they could "sacrifice" to the cause... demanding to be let into a chapel to worship God is one thing but when it is apparently and i mean apparently staged is another...
what i meant by "just another activist group" was exactly what it says and sounds, ive been part of plenty groups, mostly for animal rights, and have left a number of them due to the fact that the issues get lost in the translation, and there were plenty of times where that happened earlier at PBA. That where my lost of respect comes from as well too... but not ony that, but soul force links themsleves to the Bible and God and so thats why i was finally like well maybe this one will be different, maybe they can come in and get their point across with the Biblical based actions, I just disagree with how some of it was conducted
and with the lies... well one example was; the girl that came out, how she never said any of the stuff that soul force claimed she said. after she had walked away to go get some food for the soul force workers they started making thse statements how she elt unsafe etc... then when she returned they stopped until she left again, again im not against anything, and i want to embrace all of God's children regardless of age, sex, color or sexual orientation, we were all created in God's image and should love one another as God did for us. I guess i just look too deep into things sometimes, but i did apprecate them coming down here and i enjoyed the day, helped me out with a lot of insight towards the ISSUE AT HAND
Thanks again for having me here

[keltic63]

Godsgift: I'm hearing a lot of emotion and opinion, but I'm not sure I'm hearing any facts.

tell me more about the girl who "just came out". How do you know she feels safe and why do you think the riders said she doesn't if that isn't the case?

as far as finding out how much bail might be if they get arrested for a PLANNED civil demonstration, I think that's wise planning on their part. As far as calling it "staged" well, they did plan the demonstration, didn't they?

Tell me more about refusing the riders entrance to a chapel service. How does banning people from a worship service align with Jesus invitation to all people?

Bible based actions? help me out here, what do you think the riders should have done that would have a Bible base? Throw the moneychangers from the temple? approach some of the campus leaders and beg for the crumbs that fall to the floor? (think about the woman who asked Jesus for help and his response was that one doesn't take the children's food and feed it to the dogs)

I also have the distinct feeling that because you've participated in activism, and no longer do so, that you feel superior to those who would continue to remain activists. This is indicated by your "been there, done that" comment. Do you feel that only "lesser" people participate in activism, or that no one should ever get involved in causes that are important?

[andrewlittle]

Originally Posted by Godsgift126

i didnt mean to cause a stir at all, and i hope i address all the ?'s that were asked of me...

Please don't be too quick to apologize. Stirring and being stirred are ways in which we can all grow and learn.

when i said immature actions i meant the whole getting arrested thing. Don't get me wrong ive been arrested for a similiar type of sit in, for different purposes, but none the less have been there and done that. but the facts are and were admitted by a soul force member, that they had previously called the county to find out how much bail was for one person, knowing how many bodies they feel that they could "sacrifice" to the cause... demanding to be let into a chapel to worship God is one thing but when it is apparently and i mean apparently staged is another...

Okay! Let's recap some history.
Rev Martin Luther King Jr and many allies were arrested for civil disobedience, knowing full well that they would be.
Jesus was arrested for standing against the religious powers that be, knowing full well that he would be.
There are a heck of lot of examples before, after and inbetween, but I think those two examples should suffice. If the whole "getting arrested thing" is immature, then there is a long history and precedence for being immature for the sake of belief and faith.

As to "staged" - the common terms are "stage a sit-in", "stage a protest", etc. Civil disobedience doesn't effectively happen out of some brain fart, impetuous, disorganized accident. Civil disobedience is planned, the costs (financial and otherwise) of disobedience are considered, and an action is staged in order to make a statement. Most times the backlash of those in the position of power is anticipated and becomes a significant part of the statement. Sometimes, civil disobedience doesn't work, but that generally happens when the powers that be do not act as the protestors anticipated. That is not the case with Palm Beach Atlantic.

Anticipating some kind of rebuttal based on the private property justification for making the arrests, I will quickly address the nature of the property in question. While the school is a "private" university, it does not qualify as sitting on private property. It is a non-profit organization that benefits from public funding. By nature of being tax exempt, it makes use of public dollars - those that would ordinarily be paid into the public coffers as taxes - to further its goals. It also participates in federal student loan programs - federal programs that enable the university to do what it does. Private property issues are blurred to say the least.

Lastly, the issue of the students being arrested while trying to enter a chapel service. Speaks for itself, I think.

what i meant by "just another activist group" was exactly what it says and sounds, ive been part of plenty groups, mostly for animal rights, and have left a number of them due to the fact that the issues get lost in the translation, and there were plenty of times where that happened earlier at PBA. That where my lost of respect comes from as well too... but not ony that, but soul force links themsleves to the Bible and God and so thats why i was finally like well maybe this one will be different, maybe they can come in and get their point across with the Biblical based actions, I just disagree with how some of it was conducted.

Many of us think this is biblically based. You disagree - I can accept that. What actions would have been more biblically based in your estimation? perhaps we can all learn something.

and with the lies... well one example was; the girl that came out, how she never said any of the stuff that soul force claimed she said. after she had walked away to go get some food for the soul force workers they started making thse statements how she elt unsafe etc... then when she returned they stopped until she left again,

So far, this is "he said, she said". Some verification of your claim that lies were told would be a good thing at this point.

...again im not against anything, and i want to embrace all of God's children regardless of age, sex, color or sexual orientation, we were all created in God's image and should love one another as God did for us. I guess i just look too deep into things sometimes, but i did apprecate them coming down here and i enjoyed the day, helped me out with a lot of insight towards the ISSUE AT HAND
Thanks again for having me here

And this is why we love you. Let's reason this out together, and see if we can come to an understanding or, at least, an appreciation for each other's views. So, thanks for being here. May God bless you.

Andy

[scott snedeker]

"We will match your capacity to inflict suffering, with our capacity to endure suffering.

We will meet your physical force with soul force.

Do to us what you will and we will still love you.

We will not hate you, but we cannot in all good conscience obey your unjust laws......

And in the end we will wear you down with our capacity to suffer. And in winning our freedom we will so appeal to your heart and conscience that we will win you in the process."


This reflects the Satyagraha (Soulforce) as Ghandi put it

--MLK

[UnwrittenStories]

Originally Posted by Jamie McDaniel

Added: six of the riders are in jail overnight in Florida. Please keep them in your thoughts. I've only been in a holding cell for four hours - just long enough to start worrying about having to go to the bathroom. An overnight stay could be no fun.

Hey guys and gals! Thanks for all the thoughts and prayers! I was one of the 6 riders arrested, total time spent was 30 hours. Just wanted to say thanks to all those who were praying for us!