Your thoughts/musings/questions on bisexuality

[Dash]

Some years ago my one of my best ex-friends, Meredith, got in my face in the frame shop where we worked. Chin out, glaring up at me, she growled, "You cannot be bi! You have to pick! One or the other!"

It wasn't the easiest time. I never claimed to be bi, but gave off both straight and gay "vibes," as certain friends reported. Still conditioned by culture to expect romance with a girl, but not feeling it...no experience with guys, but never without a desperate crush on some handsome man in my life...I just couldn't imagine what it would be like to be romantically involved with a guy. My male friendships, on the other hand were always deeply spiritual, very intense and emotional...just without any awareness of erotic feeling. The crushes and the male friendships were never the same guys. Everything was mixed up.

But now, interestingly, I find myself wishing sometimes I was bi. There are women in my life that are so beautiful to me, and given particular circumstances, I suppose I'd not be opposed to giving it a try. Hahah!! I just don't want to hurt people. I've always avoided anything that might wound another's heart.

From Plato's dialogue Symposium, I got the idea of growing from a singular attraction (to one person) to a broader, all encompassing love (loving all persons), and then to knowing beauty itself. Progressing from a "monosexual" orientation, to a bisexual one, and then an all encompassing appreciation and knowledge of beauty itself regardless of the gender or state through which it manifests itself.

"For this is what it is to proceed correctly, or to be led by another, to erotics—beginning from these beautiful things here, always to proceed on up for the sake of that beauty, using these beautiful things here as steps: from one to two, and from two to all beautiful bodies; and from beautiful bodies to beautiful pursuits; and from pursuits to beautiful lessons; and from lessons to end at that lesson, which is he lesson of nothing else than the beautiful itself; and at last to know what is beauty itself."

~Plato, Symposium...trans. Seth Bernardete.

One of the more fascinating things about my attractions lately is my new appreciation for the androgynous beauty of transgendered people. Years ago, I was terrified of the concept. So...one of my last instinctive bigotries has become an attraction? I love it!! Haha!

[Mia14]

Zerbie, I had the same situations with many guys I dated in high school. We'd be a great couple until the kiss. I feel bad for those poor guys and their confusion, but I agree with you about wanting their friendship. At one point I pronounced myself permanently single and unopen to dating and then developed some great friendships with guys - but only after I was honest about there being no chance of dating.

Dash, that exerpt from Plato really gets me thinking...

[Zerbie]

Mia, I relate so much to the things you say! Yeah, yeah, and yeah! Only, I wish I'd had such a good experience with guys when I became "unavailable." Sad to report that a few guys got in my face belligerently - kind of like your friend, Dash - only in the reverse, saying "You're not a lesbian. You're bisexual." Yeah, French for they wanted in my pants and figgered they were the guy for me in some not-very-friendly way. . . In hindsight, I'm fairly certain that at least 2 of them were conflicted about their OWN orientations at the time.

Those guys were another factor in my refusal to acknowledge that I REALLY was bi, for such a long time. Their reactions only made me more adamant that I was a lesbian, and I got defensive about that label, as it was one I had really fought for, with struggle. I thought myself lesbian from childhood on until my mid-late 20s. There was one guy who was a HUGE blip on the radar screen when I was 19 - but he was 43, married, AND perennially questioning his own sexual orientation, so I stayed away. For another 8 years there was NO other male who turned me on.

I too enjoyed the quote, Dash. I relate pretty well. When I called myself lesbian, I always said Lesbian in real life but philosophically bisexual. Once I came out as REALLY bi, it felt so good to have all of me in accord, philosophically, emotionally, and physically. And finally, finally, after all those years I felt secure about my sexuality again.

As to sometimes you wish you were bi, well, maybe you're philosophically bisexual! Anyway, the book isn't written yet - life happens, and if we are open to it, it tends to lead us to wherever we belong. There are stranger things in the universe than a 'lesbian' falling for a guy (as happened with me.) Ya know, like, black holes.

[Vanessa White]

That quote is really something, what an impact it is having on me, and I know I need to go back and read it yet again. I find myself thinking on the concept almost daily of how we (hopefully) evolve throughout our lives in how we come to appreciate beauty, in others and in ourselves. I don't necessarily desire to be anything but lesbian in my orientation, but I definitely am open to creating friendships and relationships, on all levels, with both men and women in a totally new way- kind of like what Dash said about loving human beings. As far as full, complete intimacy and being in love with someone, I don't envision that full package ever being with anyone but a woman.

[Poetic Awakening]

Enjoying the stories here... though I don't really have alot of insight on a whole lot at the moment. However, when I was first questioning my confrontation with same sex attractions (weird thing was I realized that my best friend in kindergarten was actually my first crush ) I thought I might be gay, and that really threw me for a loop (sad story, believe me). But recently I've come to terms with the fact bisexuality isn't "I like girls, but I'm not opposed to guys(?)". For me, it's really more like "I like girls, and just the same, I like guys, too."

I don't know why, but I always thought (before I realized I was bi) that gay men were checking out EVERY guy! It sort of shakes things up when you see that it's just like feeling attracted to girls... you have those 'types' you like, and at times, alot of 'types' you feel perfectly fine settling on friendship with. I guess my initial impression with what I feel is that bisexuals aren't really crazed sex machines as I hear is the myth these days. It also seems to make my attractions 'healthier' towards girls when I'm more comfortable with my being bi. I guess before it was some inherent desperation to continue the species at all costs?

Anyway, as I accept myself (at least to myself, for now) I feel alot better. I don't know what the future holds, but I can feel at least good about myself on all levels in the here and now...

That's my ametuer musing attempt for today....

Poetic

[Vanessa White]

Poetic: Just wanted to welcome you to the forums and to Soulforce! Great to have you around, and we have a lot of good discussions here. I like what you have to say about no matter what gender or person attracts us, being strictly gay, straight, or bisexual, doesn't mean we are attracted to every person of one or both genders, it is still a matter of the type of person that we feel most connected with. It sounds like you are in a more comfortable place than earlier in your life, which will probably continue to evolve and grow over time. Glad to see you around! Peace, Vanessa

[Zerbie]

Awakening:

I'm glad to seeya here too.

What you said about thinking bisexuals were crazed sex-machines who indiscriminately want everybody defines for me the reason I thought I COULDN'T be bi. As I think I mentioned earlier in this thread, I'm picky, and have had a lot fewer relationships than most of my friends have had, for instance. I couldn't relate to the wild sex machine thing - so I thought I had to pick between gay and straight.

It's all a process, isn't it?

Glad to see you posting.

[Lydia]

Originally Posted by Vanessa White

being strictly gay, straight, or bisexual, doesn't mean we are attracted to every person of one or both genders, it is still a matter of the type of person that we feel most connected with.

If we were sitting in church, I'd be saying "amen" right about now.

Haven't been ignoring this thread, btw, just was busy with my SO while he was on vacation. He's back at work now.

[Zerbie]

Hey Lydia,

'Zat mean we get to hear more of your perspective on this stuff now?

I been waitin' on ya.

[Lydia]

Yes, but not tonight. Getting sleepy, and all.

[Zerbie]

Okay, we can wait another day,

Have a good night's sleep. Pleasant dreams.

[kimmyd]

Tee hee...snicker snicker...

I know what a doobie is!

Originally Posted by Zerbie

Oh. My. God.

I am still shivering from having read this - Awe!!!!!!!!

That's gotta be one of the most incredible, gorgeous things I've ever read.



But, er - what's a doobie???

Love ya,

Z

[tdogg]

Originally Posted by Dash

"For this is what it is to proceed correctly, or to be led by another, to erotics—beginning from these beautiful things here, always to proceed on up for the sake of that beauty, using these beautiful things here as steps: from one to two, and from two to all beautiful bodies; and from beautiful bodies to beautiful pursuits; and from pursuits to beautiful lessons; and from lessons to end at that lesson, which is he lesson of nothing else than the beautiful itself; and at last to know what is beauty itself."

~Plato, Symposium...trans. Seth Bernardete.

One of the more fascinating things about my attractions lately is my new appreciation for the androgynous beauty of transgendered people. Years ago, I was terrified of the concept. So...one of my last instinctive bigotries has become an attraction? I love it!! Haha!

Great quote Dash! I understand what you say about appreciating the androgynous beauty of trans people. One of the things that makes me wildly attracted to my partner is that I can see the masculine as well as feminine in her, all at the same time. It drives me crazy! I am attracted to those who are in a sense androgynous - not totally female, not totally male. Although I can appreciate a very feminine and a very masculine body. I wondered for a time if I was bisexual. But after being in my current relationship as well as a past brief 'fling' with a friend, I can say that I have no interest in a romantic relationship with a man. They make awesome friends but just don't do it for me in the romance department. I believe for someone to be truly happy and satisfied with a partner (sexual and otherwise) for any length of time, they must be fufilled not only physically, but also mentally, emotionally and spiritually. For me, that has only happened with a woman. Their softness, their tears, their caretaking heart, their hair, the fluctuations of their voice, etc. etc.

[Zerbie]

I get it Tdogg.

Didn't mean to overlook Dash's wonderful comment about the beauty of trans people.

When I was single, I wouldn't have closed the door on a relationship with a transgendered person, MtF or FtM. Or for that matter, someone who was "intersexed." Once, a long time ago when I was questioning my sexuality, I had an erotic dream in which I am making love with someone I really like, yet while that's going on, s/he keeps switching physical sexes. The details would make this an X rated post, so I will leave them to everyone's imagination, but it was a wonderful dream! It answered my question about my orientation, if only I had paid attention. I was completely open to romantic and sexual intimacy with a male or a female, or someone "in between" and all that mattered was caring, pleasuring, loving them.

I am attracted to the *being* in people. Yes, the transgendered can be very sexy and very beautiful! Completely utterly so!

[Dash]

Zerbie, I just want to say that your statement about my perhaps being "philosophically bi" has stuck with me the last few days.

It also occurred to me that I should mention that I am very attracted to a certain kind of bisexual man...and they to me. They would be the ones, of course that are married or in a relationship with a girl...sigh. I used to think their attraction to me was all in my head till observant friends confirmed it again and again. I try to own this attraction of mine and learn from it, but I've never acted on it, or responded to the (sometimes outrageous) flirting that I experience. I usually think my attractions are an indication of some quality or other that I want or need to integrate into myself. I have two such men in my world at the moment, and the chemistry is both spicy and frustrating. hahah!

[Zerbie]

Dash - Oh no! I'm contaminating your mind!

*very* interesting experiences you share. . .hmmm.

Some bisexual people have only acknowledged one "half" or another of their sexuality. That can make relating to them a little iffy, if you're of the gender they haven't acknowledged attraction for.

Even so, isn't that magnetism engaging and fun to be around? It can be scintillating! The funnest part of being single.

[Dash]

Originally Posted by Zerbie

Dash - Oh no! I'm contaminating your mind!

*very* interesting experiences you share. . .hmmm.

Some bisexual people have only acknowledged one "half" or another of their sexuality. That can make relating to them a little iffy, if you're of the gender they haven't acknowledged attraction for.

Even so, isn't that magnetism engaging and fun to be around? It can be scintillating! The funnest part of being single.

Hahah! Yes! Fun, as long as I'm not feeling all weak and desperate (it happens sometimes). Generally, it's a hoot!!!!

And I welcome you into my mind!

[Daniel]

Originally Posted by Dash

..and from lessons to end at that lesson, which is the lesson of nothing else than the beautiful itself; and at last to know what is beauty itself."

Dash- The Plato quote is absolutely mind expanding. Thank you for sharing it. Reminds me of the second song from Songs of Travel by R. Vaughn Williams. c 1905. Or course, the accompaniment adds something that can't be conveyed here unfortunately. The poem is by Robert Louis Stevenson.

Let Beauty awake in the morn from beautiful dreams,
Beauty awake from rest!
Let Beauty awake
For Beauty's sake
In the hour when the birds awake in the brake
And the stars are bright in the west!

Let Beauty awake in the eve from from the slumber of day,
Awake in the crimson eve!
In the day's dusk end
When the shades ascend,
Let her wake to the kiss of a tender friend,
To render again and recieve!

[Lydia]

Trotting in a bit late to the party.

Originally Posted by awediot

oh if you don't know what a doobie is

I didn't know what it was either. Had to go to urbandictionary.com to find out.

[Lydia]

This might be too personal of a question for a public board, but..

Originally Posted by awediot

orientation fluctuate enough to know one can settle there, and not have to settle one way or another

Does anyone else find themselves periodically finding themselves attracted to one gender more than the other? And just when you're used to that - the bigger attraction switches to the other gender?